The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

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Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by Snowflake Royal » 25 Jul 2018 21:20

RoyalJones Another one that got away? I rated Jack Stacey to be honest.

http://the72.co.uk/111220/west-brom-bid ... full-back/

Yep, letting Stacey go was just plain stupid.

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Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by NewCorkSeth » 25 Jul 2018 23:03

Snowflake Royal
RoyalJones Another one that got away? I rated Jack Stacey to be honest.

http://the72.co.uk/111220/west-brom-bid ... full-back/

Yep, letting Stacey go was just plain stupid.

Was Fosu not considered better at the time? I remember football manager quite liking Stacey a few seasons back.

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Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by Stranded » 26 Jul 2018 09:15

NewCorkSeth
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RoyalJones Another one that got away? I rated Jack Stacey to be honest.

http://the72.co.uk/111220/west-brom-bid ... full-back/

Yep, letting Stacey go was just plain stupid.

Was Fosu not considered better at the time? I remember football manager quite liking Stacey a few seasons back.


Stacey was considered a Right winger not a full back at the club, the path at RW was blocked by quite a few and even if he switched to RB, he was never going to get past Gunter and Richards, Watson seem to be rated there as well from the same age band.

It wasn't stupid to let him go, it was right for the players career. If he had stayed with us, he would still only have had a handful of appearances and maybe a loan - he certainly wouldn't be on West Brom's radar.

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Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by Hoop Blah » 26 Jul 2018 09:27

maffff
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Actually, I'm probably being a bit harsh in discounting McCarthy as he was probably young enough to count.

Given he joined the academy at 8 I'd hope he would.


I meant because he'd graduated from the Academy before the last ten years. As I said though, I think I'm being pretty harsh in excluding him.

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Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by SCIAG » 26 Jul 2018 09:35

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Snowflake Royal Yep, letting Stacey go was just plain stupid.

Was Fosu not considered better at the time? I remember football manager quite liking Stacey a few seasons back.


Stacey was considered a Right winger not a full back at the club, the path at RW was blocked by quite a few and even if he switched to RB, he was never going to get past Gunter and Richards, Watson seem to be rated there as well from the same age band.

It wasn't stupid to let him go, it was right for the players career. If he had stayed with us, he would still only have had a handful of appearances and maybe a loan - he certainly wouldn't be on West Brom's radar.

Stacey was used in a wide variety of positions at the club. We had a lot of competition at right back so naturally he spent more time on the wing, but using him at full back isn't something Luton have dreamed up.

Who is Richards? Presuming you don't mean Omar, but I may have forgotten someone. Can't really think of a senior right back other than Gunter since Kelly and Cummings.

There was very little competition for places on our wings last season. In the second half of the season, we only had Barrow and Aluko. I feel confident that Stacey would have played 15+ matches last season if we hadn't shipped him out. Plus, of course, there were only so many players ahead of him before that because we kept signing new players then not playing them. Hurtado, Popa, Harriott, Meite...

(Of course, three of those are still at the club, so they'll probably now have excellent seasons and get us promoted and I'll look like a fool)


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Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by Hoop Blah » 26 Jul 2018 09:38

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Snowflake Royal Yep, letting Stacey go was just plain stupid.

Was Fosu not considered better at the time? I remember football manager quite liking Stacey a few seasons back.


Stacey was considered a Right winger not a full back at the club, the path at RW was blocked by quite a few and even if he switched to RB, he was never going to get past Gunter and Richards, Watson seem to be rated there as well from the same age band.

It wasn't stupid to let him go, it was right for the players career. If he had stayed with us, he would still only have had a handful of appearances and maybe a loan - he certainly wouldn't be on West Brom's radar.


I remember Stacey playing right back at Reading on quite a number of occasions as it happens. A bit like Murty before him perhaps.

I was disappointed that he was let go and not given a bit more of a chance though.

A lot of fans probably rated Fosu higher than Stacey because of that cameo at Derby. For me Stacey was the better prospect though as he just looked a very mature player with good technique.

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Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by Hoop Blah » 26 Jul 2018 09:44

Sutekh Well that's not too shabby a record I think for players that have been in the Academy. Whats the full list of Academy keepers that have left in the last 10 years and how many of them were highly rated at the time.


It's not bad no.

To be honest I hadn't realised that Moore had managed to make it as far as he has but, apart from him, my thinking is that we've hyped them up quite a bit over the years and they've largely failed to live up to our PR of of them.

The majority of the keepers who've made it aren't that recent though.

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Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by SCIAG » 26 Jul 2018 10:03

Some of the goalkeepers we've had since McCarthy who were on the fringes:

- Simon Locke - now a Southampton goalkeeping coach. The same age as Walker!
- Jon Henly - signed for Ipswich after we released him, but never made an appearance and now plays (or doesn't play) for Hemel Hempstead.
- Dan Lincoln - went on trial with Arsenal but is now playing for Bognor Regis.

Think Henly and Lincoln could both reasonably claim to have had a few "sliding doors" moments but they've ended up right in the doldrums.

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Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by Hoop Blah » 26 Jul 2018 10:33

SCIAG Some of the goalkeepers we've had since McCarthy who were on the fringes:

- Simon Locke - now a Southampton goalkeeping coach. The same age as Walker!
- Jon Henly - signed for Ipswich after we released him, but never made an appearance and now plays (or doesn't play) for Hemel Hempstead.
- Dan Lincoln - went on trial with Arsenal but is now playing for Bognor Regis.

Think Henly and Lincoln could both reasonably claim to have had a few "sliding doors" moments but they've ended up right in the doldrums.


That's the kind of thing I was alluding to. They were all highly thought of and lauded at times.

There was another one whose name I can't remember but I think played for England and then had interest from, IIRC, Man Utd. The name was Santagelio or something like that. I think Man Utd took him at one point but I don't think he ever made it either.

Edit: Dean Santangelo was the fella!


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Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by SCIAG » 26 Jul 2018 11:11

That was a real WTF one. Way down the pecking order here and he goes and signs for United.

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Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by RoyalJones » 26 Jul 2018 12:43

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Snowflake Royal Yep, letting Stacey go was just plain stupid.

Was Fosu not considered better at the time? I remember football manager quite liking Stacey a few seasons back.


Stacey was considered a Right winger not a full back at the club, the path at RW was blocked by quite a few and even if he switched to RB, he was never going to get past Gunter and Richards, Watson seem to be rated there as well from the same age band.

It wasn't stupid to let him go, it was right for the players career. If he had stayed with us, he would still only have had a handful of appearances and maybe a loan - he certainly wouldn't be on West Brom's radar.

Who did we have at right mid at the time though in the 16/17 season when he left at the end of it? An inconsistent, unfit McCleary, Meite (should have probably been sent out on loan in the first season anyway) and Popa, who didn't really improve our first team considerably despite me liking him. Based on that, I think he should have got game time. Then we added Aluko in the same window Stacey left, when we clearly needed a proven striker instead of Aluko, I have no idea why Stacey didn't get more game time.

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Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by Stranded » 26 Jul 2018 13:00

RoyalJones
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NewCorkSeth Was Fosu not considered better at the time? I remember football manager quite liking Stacey a few seasons back.


Stacey was considered a Right winger not a full back at the club, the path at RW was blocked by quite a few and even if he switched to RB, he was never going to get past Gunter and Richards, Watson seem to be rated there as well from the same age band.

It wasn't stupid to let him go, it was right for the players career. If he had stayed with us, he would still only have had a handful of appearances and maybe a loan - he certainly wouldn't be on West Brom's radar.

Who did we have at right mid at the time though in the 16/17 season when he left at the end of it? An inconsistent, unfit McCleary, Meite (should have probably been sent out on loan in the first season anyway) and Popa, who didn't really improve our first team considerably despite me liking him. Based on that, I think he should have got game time. Then we added Aluko in the same window Stacey left, when we clearly needed a proven striker instead of Aluko, I have no idea why Stacey didn't get more game time.


Well we sent him on loan for 16/17 and made a play-off final so he would have been lucky to get near the team as we were winning games more weeks than not. We got a bid from Luton that we thought was acceptable at the time given his form at that level and the fact the club were planning to push on last season by bringing in Aluko and Barrow on the wings. Obviously we know now that given how poorly 17/18 was, he may have got a chance somewhere but at the time of his sale - and that is how this has to be viewed - he would not have been in with a chance of playing as he was not ready to be part of a hoped for promotion campaign.

He may be one of those who go on to great things, that happens, but any argument that it was wrong to let him go when we did because circumstances at the time of his sale meant his first team chances were likely to be close to zero.

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Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by Snowflake Royal » 26 Jul 2018 13:22

Hoop Blah
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NewCorkSeth Was Fosu not considered better at the time? I remember football manager quite liking Stacey a few seasons back.


Stacey was considered a Right winger not a full back at the club, the path at RW was blocked by quite a few and even if he switched to RB, he was never going to get past Gunter and Richards, Watson seem to be rated there as well from the same age band.

It wasn't stupid to let him go, it was right for the players career. If he had stayed with us, he would still only have had a handful of appearances and maybe a loan - he certainly wouldn't be on West Brom's radar.


I remember Stacey playing right back at Reading on quite a number of occasions as it happens. A bit like Murty before him perhaps.

I was disappointed that he was let go and not given a bit more of a chance though.

A lot of fans probably rated Fosu higher than Stacey because of that cameo at Derby. For me Stacey was the better prospect though as he just looked a very mature player with good technique.

Absolutely this. If we'd backed him rather than signing a string of failures I think there's a great chance he'd have played 20-30 games at RB and RW over the last couple of seasons had we kept him.

He may not have progressed to the same extent with that many games, but he could also have actually forced himself into the first xi with good performances and not had to step down to Exeter first.


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Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by RoyalJones » 26 Jul 2018 13:32

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Stacey was considered a Right winger not a full back at the club, the path at RW was blocked by quite a few and even if he switched to RB, he was never going to get past Gunter and Richards, Watson seem to be rated there as well from the same age band.

It wasn't stupid to let him go, it was right for the players career. If he had stayed with us, he would still only have had a handful of appearances and maybe a loan - he certainly wouldn't be on West Brom's radar.

Who did we have at right mid at the time though in the 16/17 season when he left at the end of it? An inconsistent, unfit McCleary, Meite (should have probably been sent out on loan in the first season anyway) and Popa, who didn't really improve our first team considerably despite me liking him. Based on that, I think he should have got game time. Then we added Aluko in the same window Stacey left, when we clearly needed a proven striker instead of Aluko, I have no idea why Stacey didn't get more game time.


Well we sent him on loan for 16/17 and made a play-off final so he would have been lucky to get near the team as we were winning games more weeks than not. We got a bid from Luton that we thought was acceptable at the time given his form at that level and the fact the club were planning to push on last season by bringing in Aluko and Barrow on the wings. Obviously we know now that given how poorly 17/18 was, he may have got a chance somewhere but at the time of his sale - and that is how this has to be viewed - he would not have been in with a chance of playing as he was not ready to be part of a hoped for promotion campaign.

He may be one of those who go on to great things, that happens, but any argument that it was wrong to let him go when we did because circumstances at the time of his sale meant his first team chances were likely to be close to zero.

I guess that's what makes hindsight a wonderful thing, if we had known how the Aluko signing turned out, maybe we would have kept Stacey.

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Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by Stranded » 26 Jul 2018 13:34

Hoop Blah
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NewCorkSeth Was Fosu not considered better at the time? I remember football manager quite liking Stacey a few seasons back.


Stacey was considered a Right winger not a full back at the club, the path at RW was blocked by quite a few and even if he switched to RB, he was never going to get past Gunter and Richards, Watson seem to be rated there as well from the same age band.

It wasn't stupid to let him go, it was right for the players career. If he had stayed with us, he would still only have had a handful of appearances and maybe a loan - he certainly wouldn't be on West Brom's radar.


I remember Stacey playing right back at Reading on quite a number of occasions as it happens. A bit like Murty before him perhaps.

I was disappointed that he was let go and not given a bit more of a chance though.

A lot of fans probably rated Fosu higher than Stacey because of that cameo at Derby. For me Stacey was the better prospect though as he just looked a very mature player with good technique.


I'm assuming that you are talking about in the u23s here Hoop? After all Stacey only made 6 appearances for us, with just 2 being starts - the Watford game where we played a reserve side and that Derby game, where he was injured. In every first team appearance he only ever played on the left or right of midfield.

Can only find record of him playing 4 times at RB for the u23s (according to Transfermarkt).

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Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by Snowflake Royal » 26 Jul 2018 13:35

Tbf plenty of us had a decent idea. It was widely derided as a massive waste of money for a player with a reputation for no end product.

Clearly he failed to meet even low expectations.

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Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by tidus_mi2 » 26 Jul 2018 13:53

I just wonder if we have any sell on agreed if West Brom do sign Stacey.

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Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by Hoop Blah » 26 Jul 2018 13:56

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Hoop Blah I remember Stacey playing right back at Reading on quite a number of occasions as it happens. A bit like Murty before him perhaps.

I was disappointed that he was let go and not given a bit more of a chance though.

A lot of fans probably rated Fosu higher than Stacey because of that cameo at Derby. For me Stacey was the better prospect though as he just looked a very mature player with good technique.


I'm assuming that you are talking about in the u23s here Hoop? After all Stacey only made 6 appearances for us, with just 2 being starts - the Watford game where we played a reserve side and that Derby game, where he was injured. In every first team appearance he only ever played on the left or right of midfield.

Can only find record of him playing 4 times at RB for the u23s (according to Transfermarkt).


Indeed. I just remember his playing quite a few games outside of the first team and it not being on the right wing. Couldn't tell you which ones, or even for which teams (might've been in friendlies too), but it always stuck in my mind that he was being shunted around a little.

At the time I thought it was more because he wasn't deemed good enough to get a run out on the wing, but perhaps it was more his potential at fullback.

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Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by Tilehurstsouthbank » 26 Jul 2018 14:04

tidus_mi2 I just wonder if we have any sell on agreed if West Brom do sign Stacey.


That'd be the ideal scenario.

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Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by Snowflake Royal » 26 Jul 2018 17:43

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Hoop Blah I remember Stacey playing right back at Reading on quite a number of occasions as it happens. A bit like Murty before him perhaps.

I was disappointed that he was let go and not given a bit more of a chance though.

A lot of fans probably rated Fosu higher than Stacey because of that cameo at Derby. For me Stacey was the better prospect though as he just looked a very mature player with good technique.


I'm assuming that you are talking about in the u23s here Hoop? After all Stacey only made 6 appearances for us, with just 2 being starts - the Watford game where we played a reserve side and that Derby game, where he was injured. In every first team appearance he only ever played on the left or right of midfield.

Can only find record of him playing 4 times at RB for the u23s (according to Transfermarkt).


Indeed. I just remember his playing quite a few games outside of the first team and it not being on the right wing. Couldn't tell you which ones, or even for which teams (might've been in friendlies too), but it always stuck in my mind that he was being shunted around a little.

At the time I thought it was more because he wasn't deemed good enough to get a run out on the wing, but perhaps it was more his potential at fullback.

Possibly played there some more for U18s. Vaguely remember him featuring there for the odd pre-season friendly. It certainly looked like he was going to be cover for Gunter at one point just before he was shipped out on loan or perm.

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