The Stam passing game

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genome
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Re: The Stam passing game

by genome » 19 Aug 2017 16:55

Avon Royal wrote:
Hound wrote:Did we come within 2 kicks of promotion last year or did I imagine that?

Whether it's to everyones taste or not, it brought us success last year


That's not my definition of success, and I hope the team didn't view it as success either.


Good grief

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Re: The Stam passing game

by CountryRoyal » 19 Aug 2017 17:09

CountryRoyal wrote: I think a lot of frustration builds from the fact we can go to playing well one game and shit the next and there isn't that continuous match on match improvement which id like to see.


Point proved tonight.

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Re: The Stam passing game

by Hound » 19 Aug 2017 17:19

CountryRoyal wrote:
CountryRoyal wrote: I think a lot of frustration builds from the fact we can go to playing well one game and shit the next and there isn't that continuous match on match improvement which id like to see.


Point proved tonight.


Yep. Though in some sort of mitigation our entire midfield was different after 30 mins.

But the general gist is true

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Re: The Stam passing game

by CountryRoyal » 19 Aug 2017 17:21

Hound wrote:
CountryRoyal wrote:
CountryRoyal wrote: I think a lot of frustration builds from the fact we can go to playing well one game and shit the next and there isn't that continuous match on match improvement which id like to see.


Point proved tonight.


Yep. Though in some sort of mitigation our entire midfield was different after 30 mins.

But the general gist is true


Point taken but we were just as shit before they went off.

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Re: The Stam passing game

by Elm Park Kid » 19 Aug 2017 17:21

I know it had many critics, but I enjoyed how we played under McDermott. McAnuff and Kebe bombing down the wings, swinging balls into the box, Leigertwood taking regular pot shots, Long playing off the last man. Our defence wasn't great but we somehow keep the goals tally down.


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Re: The Stam passing game

by Longhorn1970 » 19 Aug 2017 17:46

Elm Park Kid wrote:I know it had many critics, but I enjoyed how we played under McDermott. McAnuff and Kebe bombing down the wings, swinging balls into the box, Leigertwood taking regular pot shots, Long playing off the last man. Our defence wasn't great but we somehow keep the goals tally down.


the game has evolved a tad ..

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Re: The Stam passing game

by Gunny Fishcake » 19 Aug 2017 17:56

I've been watching Reading for many years and this is without doubt the most boring non entertaining type of football and team I've seen. The team maybe more skillful than teams we've had in the past but I'd rather see a team attack more have a go and lose rather than today against Preston where according to BBC Sport we had 59% possession, and one shot on target and lost. It's killing the atmosphere at home games and fans are starting to stay away. At the end of the day we all pay good money to be entertained , have a bit of excitement , see a good competitive game of football and hopefully see our team win by scoring a few goals rather than thirty passes along the back four with the opposition sitting back and waiting for us the f*ck it up.

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Re: The Stam passing game

by leon » 19 Aug 2017 18:38

Longhorn1970 wrote:
Elm Park Kid wrote:I know it had many critics, but I enjoyed how we played under McDermott. McAnuff and Kebe bombing down the wings, swinging balls into the box, Leigertwood taking regular pot shots, Long playing off the last man. Our defence wasn't great but we somehow keep the goals tally down.


the game has evolved a tad ..


No it hasn't. There isn't only one way of playing.

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Re: The Stam passing game

by Oilroyal » 19 Aug 2017 19:02

Gunny Fishcake wrote:I've been watching Reading for many years and this is without doubt the most boring non entertaining type of football and team I've seen. The team maybe more skillful than teams we've had in the past but I'd rather see a team attack more have a go and lose rather than today against Preston where according to BBC Sport we had 59% possession, and one shot on target and lost. It's killing the atmosphere at home games and fans are starting to stay away. At the end of the day we all pay good money to be entertained , have a bit of excitement , see a good competitive game of football and hopefully see our team win by scoring a few goals rather than thirty passes along the back four with the opposition sitting back and waiting for us the f*ck it up.


I think Stam and the club are laying the foundations for a style of play that will eventually survive and flourish in the premier league. A style of discipline, patience, pace and quality all-round the pitch. Throw in the odd glimpse of product called a goal in to a 90-minute game and there you have it, a premier league product.

Unfortunately, right now we lack the quality so Stam must teach it. In a way, this is now my entertainment, the excitement of being a Reading supporter witnessing the development of Stam and this team unfold within a 3-year plan of becoming Prem ready.

I stretch back to the Brantfoot days and have witnessed the McGee teams, the Coppell teams and the McD days. But I’m much happier with the direction the club is now heading in terms of building a style of play and a squad capable of going up and staying up
.
Although right now my frustration is having finished a season only a pen kick away from promotion to then start a new season in such a sluggish way, both in preparation and results. And not knowing from one game to the next if the team can produce any consistent performance. That’s the biggest challenge to me following Reading.

The club and owners will stick with their plan in the hope of a return on their investment and the riches of the premier league. Us fans, all we want to see is GOALS and an away plan B!! Those were the days :)


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Re: The Stam passing game

by royalp-we » 19 Aug 2017 19:43

^fantastic post oilroyal

I totally agree with all you have said.

I think that some fans are frustrated as we clearly have some talent in our ranks. Players that can drive on and can create and leave defenders on their heels. But too often our attackers are not performing to the best of their abilities. That therefore makes this style hard to accept at times. Because lets face it, if we were creating and scoring, the passing around the back 4 and having 76% possession would be acceptable! Very rarely is our backline singled out for poor performances. Our attacking play needs to improve to get us to the next level.

I honestly think players like Swift, Beerens, McCleary, Popa, Clement really need to step up to the grade when we are moving forward with the ball. Final balls have also not been good enough for some time now. Slick accjrate passing is part of this style and they need to improve now they know what is expected from Stams style. Full back wise Obita does, I think Blackett has it in his locker, but Gunter may be put under pressure by Bacuna unless he steps up accuracy of final balls too.

Barrow and Kelly have impressed and are the only attacking players who you can say deserve to start atm as they are performing in the opponents half of the pitch!
Last edited by royalp-we on 19 Aug 2017 19:55, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: The Stam passing game

by Hound » 19 Aug 2017 19:44

I think the one real criticism of Stam from me is the away plan B

If we go a goal down we rarely seem likely to come back - too many games ending in lame narrow defeats (i.e. Today) or thrashings

I suppose things may be different when you can chuck on a Yann/Mendes and go long for example, but just don't really see signs of it happening. Too many times teams go ahead, sit back and wait to hit us on the break

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Re: The Stam passing game

by Lower West » 19 Aug 2017 22:49

Passing game is fine. Though as was the case today. Too many poor passes were made. Players having too many touches before moving the ball on. A lack of tempo in our play. An inability to stretch the opposition defence. When the passing game doesn't work or we do find ourselves a goal down. What's Plan B when playing away from home.

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Re: The Stam passing game

by leon » 19 Aug 2017 23:09

Lower West wrote:Passing game is fine. Though as was the case today. Too many poor passes were made. Players having too many touches before moving the ball on. A lack of tempo in our play. An inability to stretch the opposition defence. When the passing game doesn't work or we do find ourselves a goal down. What's Plan B when playing away from home.


That fool Adkins and the charlatan Clarke produced this kind of shit with no success. I do wish we could just play some decent attacking football and try, at least, to fcuking defend.


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Re: The Stam passing game

by John Madejski's Wallet » 19 Aug 2017 23:39

Oilroyal wrote:
Gunny Fishcake wrote:I've been watching Reading for many years and this is without doubt the most boring non entertaining type of football and team I've seen. The team maybe more skillful than teams we've had in the past but I'd rather see a team attack more have a go and lose rather than today against Preston where according to BBC Sport we had 59% possession, and one shot on target and lost. It's killing the atmosphere at home games and fans are starting to stay away. At the end of the day we all pay good money to be entertained , have a bit of excitement , see a good competitive game of football and hopefully see our team win by scoring a few goals rather than thirty passes along the back four with the opposition sitting back and waiting for us the f*ck it up.


I think Stam and the club are laying the foundations for a style of play that will eventually survive and flourish in the premier league. A style of discipline, patience, pace and quality all-round the pitch. Throw in the odd glimpse of product called a goal in to a 90-minute game and there you have it, a premier league product.

Really?

I'd have said slow, possession-based football is almost the anti-thesis of premier league football.

The only premier league input Stamp has brought the Reading is a complete inability to defend

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Re: The Stam passing game

by Oilroyal » 19 Aug 2017 23:55

John Madejski's Wallet wrote:
Oilroyal wrote:
Gunny Fishcake wrote:I've been watching Reading for many years and this is without doubt the most boring non entertaining type of football and team I've seen. The team maybe more skillful than teams we've had in the past but I'd rather see a team attack more have a go and lose rather than today against Preston where according to BBC Sport we had 59% possession, and one shot on target and lost. It's killing the atmosphere at home games and fans are starting to stay away. At the end of the day we all pay good money to be entertained , have a bit of excitement , see a good competitive game of football and hopefully see our team win by scoring a few goals rather than thirty passes along the back four with the opposition sitting back and waiting for us the f*ck it up.


I think Stam and the club are laying the foundations for a style of play that will eventually survive and flourish in the premier league. A style of discipline, patience, pace and quality all-round the pitch. Throw in the odd glimpse of product called a goal in to a 90-minute game and there you have it, a premier league product.

Really?

I'd have said slow, possession-based football is almost the anti-thesis of premier league football.

The only premier league input Stamp has brought the Reading is a complete inability to defend


It helps if you read the whole post and if you did, then your post make no sense. For Stam’s style to work we need quality, we’re not there yet, not by a long way. Once he builds a team capable of playing his procession based football, then if we do get promoted we’ll stand a better chance of staying up.

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Re: The Stam passing game

by Snowflake Royal » 20 Aug 2017 08:17

Lower West wrote:Passing game is fine. Though as was the case today. Too many poor passes were made. Players having too many touches before moving the ball on. A lack of tempo in our play. An inability to stretch the opposition defence. When the passing game doesn't work or we do find ourselves a goal down. What's Plan B when playing away from home.

Plan B is make subs and / or change shape. It is never going to be completely change playing philosophy.

People need to recognise that playing badly is not a failure of the plan, it's a failure of the players applucation in most cases. They aren't going to suddenly do much better switching to playing an alien philosophy mid-game.

This game seems a case in point. Most accounts I've heard said towards the end we played very direct (for us) to Mendes. Didn't get us anywhere at all.

Despite the popularity of the buzz phrase, failure in a game does not mean there has been no Plan B. And I'd go as far as saying any plan b that isn't a tweak of plan a is too big a change and doomed to failure.

We're four games in. People need to accept we're going to lose plenty of games, even if we win tye league. That's natural. It's not a failure. We don't have a right to win every week and it's not a sign of something being wrong. We just move on to the next game.

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Re: The Stam passing game

by Snowflake Royal » 20 Aug 2017 08:27

John Madejski's Wallet wrote:
Oilroyal wrote:
Gunny Fishcake wrote:I've been watching Reading for many years and this is without doubt the most boring non entertaining type of football and team I've seen. The team maybe more skillful than teams we've had in the past but I'd rather see a team attack more have a go and lose rather than today against Preston where according to BBC Sport we had 59% possession, and one shot on target and lost. It's killing the atmosphere at home games and fans are starting to stay away. At the end of the day we all pay good money to be entertained , have a bit of excitement , see a good competitive game of football and hopefully see our team win by scoring a few goals rather than thirty passes along the back four with the opposition sitting back and waiting for us the f*ck it up.


I think Stam and the club are laying the foundations for a style of play that will eventually survive and flourish in the premier league. A style of discipline, patience, pace and quality all-round the pitch. Throw in the odd glimpse of product called a goal in to a 90-minute game and there you have it, a premier league product.

Really?

I'd have said slow, possession-based football is almost the anti-thesis of premier league football.

The only premier league input Stamp has brought the Reading is a complete inability to defend

If you want to do well in the PL you need to be able to keeo the ball effectively. Too much of our game plan is currently around that to be successful in the PL because we stull make too many mistakes which will be punished. But as we get better and more incisive in attack it'll be easier to adapt to the right balance than the turgid, but very effective (at a lower level) stuff McDermott served up first time.

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Re: The Stam passing game

by Hound » 20 Aug 2017 08:31

I like the main gist of your post and generally agree

I'd argue a little on the plan b side. I agree it's not just a case of suddenly switching game plan and all will change. But whatever we are doing when we go a goal down away we need to look at.

I'd like to see us make changes to the shape a little earlier - admittedly we were hamstrung by the nature of the subs we had to make early yesterday

But I do think we could do things like go 3 at the back - put the wingers in the FB positions as an example.

Maybe it's just a mentality change needed

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Re: The Stam passing game

by Snowflake Royal » 20 Aug 2017 08:38

I think it's a get better change.

I'd quite happily see one sub take us from

Mannone
Gunter, McShane, Moore, Blackett
Swift, Bacuna, Kelly
Popa, Clement, Barrow

To

Mannone
McShane, Moore, Blackett
Popa, Swift, Bacuna, Kelly, Barrow
Clement, Mendes

Taking ysterday as an example. But I'm not sure I'd want to do that earlier than 70 minutes

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Re: The Stam passing game

by Avon Royal » 20 Aug 2017 17:17

genome wrote:
Avon Royal wrote:
Hound wrote:Did we come within 2 kicks of promotion last year or did I imagine that?

Whether it's to everyones taste or not, it brought us success last year


That's not my definition of success, and I hope the team didn't view it as success either.


Good grief


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