In or Out?

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Stam - In or Out?

In
100
42%
Out
106
44%
Shake it all about
16
7%
Ian Royal
17
7%
 
Total votes: 239
Royalwaster
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Re: In or Out?

by Royalwaster » 24 Dec 2017 14:18

Royality creeps In
bobby1413 Stam IN definitely

In a way I want to see him sacked just as punishment for yesterdays disgrace. But I don't think that's right or sensible. I still think we are building


Stopped reading here as I fell off my stool in raptures of sarcastic laughter!


Well you should have kept reading as it was a good post.

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tidus_mi2
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Re: In or Out?

by tidus_mi2 » 24 Dec 2017 14:19

Still in for now but yesterday was huge points against Stam, just after we seemed to be turning a corner we get two terrible performances and 2 defeats. As we seem thoroughly trenched in mid-table right now, unless we take a nose-dive I think we should just be evaluating everything at the end of the season.

Honestly though I can't see any reason to sack him unless we get dragged into a relegation scrap, otherwise it's another case of stupid short-termism, where manager's get no credit for previous good work, to me it seems ridiculous to sack a guy after taking a side who finished 19th and 17th in previous seasons to 3rd the next season but then only be mid-table.

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Re: In or Out?

by Dennis the Butler » 24 Dec 2017 14:49

I seriously think any manager from League's 1 or 2 would have a better idea than Stam atm ..

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Re: In or Out?

by CavershamRoyal » 24 Dec 2017 14:49

Still can't believe anyone would want to sack Stam at this point. Yes, yesterday was awful, but the games I've been to (admittedly only at home) this season have been generally more entertaining (Villa, Wolves, Forest, Barnsley, Cardiff come to mind) than last year - we're just not managing to hold on for three points like we so often did last season.

Kermorgant was vital but seems to have regressed after his injury, and Bod doesn't look like a natural finisher. We've arguably replaced Williams pretty well with Bacuna, but he's playing in a less effective role due to a long-term injury to our only senior LB.

Things haven't really gone right for us this season for one reason or another, and I do realise that Stam spent a fair bit in the Summer (although perhaps down to the hugely inflated market prices). But you don't fluke 3rd place in an extremely competitive league, and he's earned at least this season to turn things around. I don't think sacking him now will get us anywhere.

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Sutekh
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Re: In or Out?

by Sutekh » 24 Dec 2017 15:09

Half of me wants Reading to lose and be embarrassing so we can change this dreadfully crappy style of football for something that at least passes for entertainment while the other half wants Stam to be a success and turn it round.

Either Jaap's trying to move it on from last year and half the players are just not up to it - in which case he needs to find another way until he has the playing staff needed or he's just clueless.

Yesterday it was all about bad decisions and a lack of movement leading to an inexcusably bl**dy awful performance on the pitch YET AGAIN and while you can understand you get games like that every so often, to have it so regularly from what is a reasonably talented squad for the level they're playing at, rather suggests the management are largely the problem either through inexperience or through stupidity and intransigence

Overall the sooner this miserable season's over the better, just hope the club can get another 8 wins or so sooner rather than later.

As to Jaap, well I don't think I care if he's stays or goes but he probably has been the best of the last 4 managers (although McDermott never got any backing to build anything so doesn't really count) so, unless this team gets relegated, one last chance for next season is probably on the cards.


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bobby1413
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Re: In or Out?

by bobby1413 » 24 Dec 2017 15:53

Royalwaster Well you should have kept reading as it was a good post.


Awww, thanks lovey :P

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Snowflake Royal
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Re: In or Out?

by Snowflake Royal » 24 Dec 2017 15:56

genome Well that was before we lost a home to Burton, leon. If you read Ian's post on the BFTG it's quite a shift in view

I'm not Stam Out quite yet, because we've only lost 3 in 10 games, but it's getting increasingly harder to stick up for him. If we lose the next two, then I think it's probably time for a change.

I've been pretty consistent that I thought Stam needed at least 20 games this season before he could really be judged. And that, bar that little run recently it hadn't been good enough. To have had that improvement and then quickly gone backwards again, despite having most of the key injuries resolved is bad.

I still support the intent to retain the ball and play passing and possession based, but I'm increasingly convinced that Stam is so focused on the style that he's completely forgotten that the reason you play that way is to attack, score goals and win games effectively. We're just so passive it hurts.

That doesn't mean I've changed my mind that getting his back after 10 games is stupid, or hating all attempts to play a possession based passing style is stupid, or that loads of our fans are over-entitled fools with no clue about football.

And it's not too late to save things. But there has to be a dramatic improvement in pitchside application and direction. Not necessarily results, bar a total collapse we're too good to go down compared to the bottom few. But there needs to be signs of shoots of rebirth for next season.

Hopefully this is a winter temporary set-back and we'll bounce back quickly. Need some more wins.

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leon
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Re: In or Out?

by leon » 24 Dec 2017 16:17

Yesterday was utterly appalling and pretty much sums up RFC at the moment. The football has been dreadful.

However I still think there’s a decent manager in there so instead of sacking Stam we need a really experienced assistant to help him make the right decisions, fix the defence and get the best out of the team.

Having a strong management team makes you a better leader.

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Re: In or Out?

by Chelsea/Royal » 26 Dec 2017 08:40

Everyone knew how Burton were going to set up, except Stam apparently. They were there for the taking and he still insisted on 1 up top against what is basically a well organised League 1 side.

It's either arrogance or incompetence to fail to recognise what's going wrong within the game and to fail to fix it.

McShane thinks he is Maldini but he certainly is not. Moore will be off if he's got any sense and then we are into Blackett/ Ilori territory!

It's going to be a very long rest of the season....


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bobby1413
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Re: In or Out?

by bobby1413 » 26 Dec 2017 10:09

I posted on another thread something similar to the below.

I genuinely don't get it. People saying Stam was the only one not to know how Burton would set up. And Stam failed to do ABC and XYZ.

What I don't understand is, doesn't Stam have a management team? Like those guys who take over and suddenly 3-4 other back room guys are announced. Maybe he's that inexperienced he doesn't have a convoy or groupies like this yet?

I'd have thought that on a Wednesday him and his trustees would meet.

If we assume Stam Is an idiot and devoid of any football knowledge, surely his 3-4 trusted guys who research and prepare a briefing of the upcoming team would say "Listen up Yip Jaap ... Burton are bottom of the league. They're poor defensively, if we have two up front we can really tear them to bits ... look at this footage from the last few games ..."

Doesn't this happen??!

Equally i would have thought at half time and even during the game his staff would say "Yip Jaap, this is absolutely shocking. Change this around, push him up, take him off and put this other guy on"

Either:

A) bsckroom staff don't do this

B) his backroom staff are terrible at their job

C) Jaap Stam is too arrogant and stupid to listen to them

D) it's all the players fault for not actually doing what's being taught and instructed

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genome
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Re: In or Out?

by genome » 26 Dec 2017 10:10

leon Yesterday was utterly appalling and pretty much sums up RFC at the moment. The football has been dreadful.

However I still think there’s a decent manager in there so instead of sacking Stam we need a really experienced assistant to help him make the right decisions, fix the defence and get the best out of the team.

Having a strong management team makes you a better leader.


Makes you wonder how influential Steven Reid was... it all went tits up after he left!

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Royal Rother
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Re: In or Out?

by Royal Rother » 26 Dec 2017 10:36

Of course he has to go.

The football is TERRIBLE.

There will always be a loyal hardcore but are so many other things to do with leisure time in the 21st Century that people need a crumb of entertainment to get themselves out of the house to make the journey to the Madejski Stadium and home again (and all the time, money and hassle that entails).

After the Burton game I heard a chunk of the phone in to BBC Berks and there was a common theme - people just didn’t really fancy going anymore because it wasn’t worth 5p let alone £5. Normally the phone ins are a bit embarrassing but actually they were a decent set this time - the only one who came across as a bit of a dick was the lone voice in support of Stam.

Not that we would be willing to pay enough to get him but a Pulis team would provide more entertainment and less frustration than Stam’s.

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Re: In or Out?

by UpNorth » 26 Dec 2017 10:55

This poll is starting to look like an accurate mirror of opinion - the gap is closing 44% in but now 42% out. These next three games look critical.

I fear that the players no longer believe in Stam's very technical approach and are too concerned about making mistakes. This style is not what is needed to be successful in the Championship and almost everyone apart from Stam knows it. It looks as if Stam has lost the dressing room and it is difficult to see how he can recover from this.

Am hoping for a much more positive style of play against Bristol but suspect we will continue to have lots of ineffective possession and be outmuscled for the ball when it matters.


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bobby1413
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Re: In or Out?

by bobby1413 » 26 Dec 2017 11:08

UpNorth This poll is starting to look like an accurate mirror of opinion - the gap is closing 44% in but now 42% out. These next three games look critical.

I fear that the players no longer believe in Stam's very technical approach and are too concerned about making mistakes. This style is not what is needed to be successful in the Championship and almost everyone apart from Stam knows it. It looks as if Stam has lost the dressing room and it is difficult to see how he can recover from this.

Am hoping for a much more positive style of play against Bristol but suspect we will continue to have lots of ineffective possession and be outmuscled for the ball when it matters.


Very good post, particularly the middle paragraph.

I said to my non football liking m8 the Championship is a fight over 46 games. A scrap for points. About 10 clubs who could have a chance of going up.

It's not about passing like an old Arsenal team, or Barcelona into the net.

It's also about adjusting each week to different teams and what's needed for the point(s).

I think you're right. I think players are very very down beat and fed up. Probably why many didn't bother thanking the booing fans on Saturday.

I'd imagine as a pro the worst thing you could feel is like you can't do what's natural because you've been told to keep to a system m. Eg you see a big open up and you feel there's a run there. But no you instead pass sideways as that's the system.

I'm STAM IN. But I'm no where near as strong on that as I was about 6 games ago.

Saturday really really fcked me off. It was almost an insult to serve that absolute dross and sh*t up to 20'000 spectators.

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72 bus
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Re: In or Out?

by 72 bus » 26 Dec 2017 11:50

This will be the first time I have missed two home games in a row in the last fifteen years, the football just so boring, not really worth turning up for.
Seriously considering not renewing next season as I just don't enjoy the football being served up.

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Re: In or Out?

by Millsy » 26 Dec 2017 15:25

I was IN until the last game.

Unless he brings in a phenomenal striker and things change overnight in a bit of a Jason Roberts sort of scenario then I'm finally saying out.

Not getting a striker, unforgivable generally but he stayed loyal to us so I'll let it go and last season although was lucky in my opinion was still fairly ok.

Possession football that's not working, has been forgivable given he's trying to implement his style.

BUT

I've lost patience and am stunned by the Burton postmatch interview. Him saying "yeah I don't know why they're keeping so much possession - I'd prefer otherwise but they're not pushing forwards" tells me he doesn't know what's going on and can't change things. He's the flipping manager. If he doesn't have the right players he needs to adapt. If he does then he clearly cant' implement his plan and it's been long enough.

Unless something massive happens in a few days he should go. This must be why lately I've been hoping we lose games :oops:

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Harpers So Solid Crew
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Re: In or Out?

by Harpers So Solid Crew » 26 Dec 2017 16:37

Message sent , same as twice before. Let's see if it's third time lucky.
I hope so

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genome
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Re: In or Out?

by genome » 26 Dec 2017 16:54

Next two results are pivotal; we are playing the two sides with the worst form in the division.

We should get six points really, but less than three points for me and I think he should go.

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Re: In or Out?

by Forest Gump » 26 Dec 2017 17:26

This has gone on too long now.
We’ve suffered too many losing runs and although this season is over from a play off perspective it will soon turn into a relegation battle if form doesn’t improve.
Of course the Clubs owners are at fault in that they broke the promises of funding that they made - as evidenced by Stam deliberately playing weakened teams at the beginning of the season.
However, we can’t expect the owners to quit so they have to replace Stam with a manager that will work with them and turn out a team that will make the fans want to watch them.
Currently the team is boring and underperforming in all positions.
They are weak away from home and To predictable at home.

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Oilroyal
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Re: In or Out?

by Oilroyal » 26 Dec 2017 17:49

He's a FUN SPONGE!
The players aren't happy, fans aren't happy, the owners can't be happy. He's slowly sucked the fun out of this club and everyone connected to it.

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