The fans alternative course of action.

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Sebastian the Red
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Re: The fans alternative course of action.

by Sebastian the Red » 22 Feb 2018 19:04

BR0B0T wrote:
Sebastian the Red wrote:It's not incumbent upon us to do anything at all. Football is an entertainment product and nothing more. If they want the company to keep existing, and maintain a customer base, they need to provide a decent, well priced product. Of course, football clubs are a little different to other entertainment providers because they have somehow managed to exploit human willingness to succumb to tribalism, but in reality it's no different to pop music, movies or video games.


Listen...

if we wanted advice on how to live our own lives and not do it vicariously through 11 thick-as-fcuk footballing pcunts

we'd ask for it!

Alright?


u ok hun?

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Re: The fans alternative course of action.

by Royality creeps In » 22 Feb 2018 19:39

Snowflake Royal wrote:
Royality creeps In wrote:Bottom line is its bloody impossible to get passionate and excited about our dull boring tactics.
How can you chant and cheer pass backs and cross area possession?


It takes two to Tango Mr Stam

We've managed it in the past. It doesn't take any special inspiration to stand up and sing Molly Malone. You just do it.


Really!

From what I can ascertain is that you don't even go to games. I do.

Don't tell me what to do. Thank you very much

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leon
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Re: The fans alternative course of action.

by leon » 22 Feb 2018 21:56

Well quite.

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Re: The fans alternative course of action.

by westendgirl » 22 Feb 2018 22:47

Sebastian the Red wrote:It's not incumbent upon us to do anything at all. Football is an entertainment product and nothing more. .


Have you heard that the more you put in the more you get out? Join in the entertainment and you will enjoy the experience more (whether you enjoy the football is up to you).

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Re: The fans alternative course of action.

by Zip » 22 Feb 2018 23:13

handbags_harris wrote:What Stam says about the fans from now on is irrelevant as far as I'm concerned. He's entitled to his opinion of course, but no matter how well he means the things he says, he no longer has the support of the majority which is all but a position of dead man walking.

But regardless of Stam and the way he presents his arguments (and I've been a vocal critic of many of his managerial facets), one of the biggest issues this club has had over the last few years is its supporters - we all want the same thing, we each have a different opinion on how we should reach the ultimate goal but Jesus, we don't half have a precious "the players must entertain me" mentality. The sooner people realise that we support a club that has far from a divine right to be "entertained" every single match the better. We're not Chelsea, Man Utd, or Liverpool, we don't possess the quality of player to be able to win matches from a base of supporter expectancy. We're Reading, and regardless of the club's outlay on our players those players will still need to battle, scrap and fight as much as play because the opponents we face week in week out are our equals, we are not inherently better than them. If they don't battle, scrap or show 100% on the pitch then fine, express dissatisfaction however you see fit. oxf*rd what Stam thinks, says or does, provided the players show courage and determination and give 100% on the pitch they'll have my backing regardless of whether they're playing well or not. We're far too passive and reactive a fanbase, people from other clubs literally take the piss every oxf*rd week about us, but the point of sitting on your hands and expecting to be entertained has long gone. It's easy to be positive when you're losing just twice in a 46 game season. It's easy to be positive when your team plays high intensity, free flowing football, it's easy to be positive when you win 16 from 18 matches and snatch the league title. We've had a paucity of consistently good results and performances since the last relegation but surely the time has now come for the fans to realise that we need to do what we can to help? Because at the moment, we're not, we're exacerbating a shit situation. We know we're not going to be entertained by the sterile dross that's on display but we can at least try to make a difference and liven up the performances. It's up to us to do what we can to raise the playing level, and if ever there was a time to start taking the bull by the horns it's now.



We have seen precious little entertainment all season. I saw more entertainment watching us in the lower divisions at Elm Park. The club cannot expect supporters to keep turning out watching a lousy product week in week out. Plenty of ST holders including myself have missed a number of games this season in the knowledge the fare was going to be abysmal.

None of expect us to play free flowing football each week. However it is not unreasonable to expect just a tad of excitement from the most extensively assembled squad in our entire history.


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Snowflake Royal
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Re: The fans alternative course of action.

by Snowflake Royal » 22 Feb 2018 23:40

Royality creeps In wrote:
Snowflake Royal wrote:
Royality creeps In wrote:Bottom line is its bloody impossible to get passionate and excited about our dull boring tactics.
How can you chant and cheer pass backs and cross area possession?


It takes two to Tango Mr Stam

We've managed it in the past. It doesn't take any special inspiration to stand up and sing Molly Malone. You just do it.


Really!

From what I can ascertain is that you don't even go to games. I do.

Don't tell me what to do. Thank you very much

Don't believe everything you read. I also didn't tell you what to do. I said people could do something if they so choose.

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Sebastian the Red
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Re: The fans alternative course of action.

by Sebastian the Red » 23 Feb 2018 09:46

westendgirl wrote:
Sebastian the Red wrote:It's not incumbent upon us to do anything at all. Football is an entertainment product and nothing more. .


Have you heard that the more you put in the more you get out? Join in the entertainment and you will enjoy the experience more (whether you enjoy the football is up to you).


Yes, I find that the more I scream at actors throughout a play in the theatre the better they perform. Same is true of movies, whooping along and gasping and making comments to my friends definitely improves the experience for everyone.

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Re: The fans alternative course of action.

by westendgirl » 23 Feb 2018 09:54

Sebastian the Red wrote:
westendgirl wrote:
Sebastian the Red wrote:It's not incumbent upon us to do anything at all. Football is an entertainment product and nothing more. .


Have you heard that the more you put in the more you get out? Join in the entertainment and you will enjoy the experience more (whether you enjoy the football is up to you).


Yes, I find that the more I scream at actors throughout a play in the theatre the better they perform. Same is true of movies, whooping along and gasping and making comments to my friends definitely improves the experience for everyone.


Certanly works at concerts - which given the type of accommodation is a better comparison.

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Sebastian the Red
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Re: The fans alternative course of action.

by Sebastian the Red » 23 Feb 2018 10:17

That's certainly not true of the concerts I've attended at the Royal Albert Hall.


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Re: The fans alternative course of action.

by Hound » 23 Feb 2018 12:26

Sebastian the Red wrote:
westendgirl wrote:
Sebastian the Red wrote:It's not incumbent upon us to do anything at all. Football is an entertainment product and nothing more. .


Have you heard that the more you put in the more you get out? Join in the entertainment and you will enjoy the experience more (whether you enjoy the football is up to you).


Yes, I find that the more I scream at actors throughout a play in the theatre the better they perform. Same is true of movies, whooping along and gasping and making comments to my friends definitely improves the experience for everyone.


yeah agree. Footy would be far better if we all sat in silence, clapped at the end, and maybe even threw flowers on the pitch if they had done really well...

You're not exactly comparing like for like here Seb.

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Re: The fans alternative course of action.

by Silver Fox » 23 Feb 2018 12:26

Sebastian the Red wrote:Who is this Gazza you speak of? Isn't there an opera called La Gazza Ladra?.

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Re: The fans alternative course of action.

by Sebastian the Red » 23 Feb 2018 12:38

Silver Fox wrote:
Sebastian the Red wrote:Who is this Gazza you speak of? Isn't there an opera called La Gazza Ladra?.


Massive fan of the overture, although I must say I much prefer some of Rossini's other works. Actually, I could probably say the same for William Tell which, aside from the incredibly famous overture, is (to my ears at least) unremarkable.

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Re: The fans alternative course of action.

by handbags_harris » 23 Feb 2018 13:23

Zip wrote:
handbags_harris wrote:What Stam says about the fans from now on is irrelevant as far as I'm concerned. He's entitled to his opinion of course, but no matter how well he means the things he says, he no longer has the support of the majority which is all but a position of dead man walking.

But regardless of Stam and the way he presents his arguments (and I've been a vocal critic of many of his managerial facets), one of the biggest issues this club has had over the last few years is its supporters - we all want the same thing, we each have a different opinion on how we should reach the ultimate goal but Jesus, we don't half have a precious "the players must entertain me" mentality. The sooner people realise that we support a club that has far from a divine right to be "entertained" every single match the better. We're not Chelsea, Man Utd, or Liverpool, we don't possess the quality of player to be able to win matches from a base of supporter expectancy. We're Reading, and regardless of the club's outlay on our players those players will still need to battle, scrap and fight as much as play because the opponents we face week in week out are our equals, we are not inherently better than them. If they don't battle, scrap or show 100% on the pitch then fine, express dissatisfaction however you see fit. oxf*rd what Stam thinks, says or does, provided the players show courage and determination and give 100% on the pitch they'll have my backing regardless of whether they're playing well or not. We're far too passive and reactive a fanbase, people from other clubs literally take the piss every oxf*rd week about us, but the point of sitting on your hands and expecting to be entertained has long gone. It's easy to be positive when you're losing just twice in a 46 game season. It's easy to be positive when your team plays high intensity, free flowing football, it's easy to be positive when you win 16 from 18 matches and snatch the league title. We've had a paucity of consistently good results and performances since the last relegation but surely the time has now come for the fans to realise that we need to do what we can to help? Because at the moment, we're not, we're exacerbating a shit situation. We know we're not going to be entertained by the sterile dross that's on display but we can at least try to make a difference and liven up the performances. It's up to us to do what we can to raise the playing level, and if ever there was a time to start taking the bull by the horns it's now.



We have seen precious little entertainment all season. I saw more entertainment watching us in the lower divisions at Elm Park. The club cannot expect supporters to keep turning out watching a lousy product week in week out. Plenty of ST holders including myself have missed a number of games this season in the knowledge the fare was going to be abysmal.

None of expect us to play free flowing football each week. However it is not unreasonable to expect just a tad of excitement from the most extensively assembled squad in our entire history.


I hear what you say, and almost everybody will agree with you. Does that completely excuse the total lethargy exhibited by our supporters though?


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Re: The fans alternative course of action.

by 2 world wars, 1 world cup » 23 Feb 2018 14:01

I'm done with being negative. If they wanted to get rid of Stam they would. They haven't.

I'm backing our boys.

Well, in spirit. I'm not paying to see that sh*t, but I'm behind them from my armchair 100% and support Stam until the first ten games of the new season. If I'd already sunk money into a ST I'd be there and cheering the boys. No booing (and I'm usually a boo boy when the game's not active).

Come on Reading!

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Re: The fans alternative course of action.

by leon » 23 Feb 2018 14:07

handbags_harris wrote:
Zip wrote:
handbags_harris wrote:What Stam says about the fans from now on is irrelevant as far as I'm concerned. He's entitled to his opinion of course, but no matter how well he means the things he says, he no longer has the support of the majority which is all but a position of dead man walking.

But regardless of Stam and the way he presents his arguments (and I've been a vocal critic of many of his managerial facets), one of the biggest issues this club has had over the last few years is its supporters - we all want the same thing, we each have a different opinion on how we should reach the ultimate goal but Jesus, we don't half have a precious "the players must entertain me" mentality. The sooner people realise that we support a club that has far from a divine right to be "entertained" every single match the better. We're not Chelsea, Man Utd, or Liverpool, we don't possess the quality of player to be able to win matches from a base of supporter expectancy. We're Reading, and regardless of the club's outlay on our players those players will still need to battle, scrap and fight as much as play because the opponents we face week in week out are our equals, we are not inherently better than them. If they don't battle, scrap or show 100% on the pitch then fine, express dissatisfaction however you see fit. oxf*rd what Stam thinks, says or does, provided the players show courage and determination and give 100% on the pitch they'll have my backing regardless of whether they're playing well or not. We're far too passive and reactive a fanbase, people from other clubs literally take the piss every oxf*rd week about us, but the point of sitting on your hands and expecting to be entertained has long gone. It's easy to be positive when you're losing just twice in a 46 game season. It's easy to be positive when your team plays high intensity, free flowing football, it's easy to be positive when you win 16 from 18 matches and snatch the league title. We've had a paucity of consistently good results and performances since the last relegation but surely the time has now come for the fans to realise that we need to do what we can to help? Because at the moment, we're not, we're exacerbating a shit situation. We know we're not going to be entertained by the sterile dross that's on display but we can at least try to make a difference and liven up the performances. It's up to us to do what we can to raise the playing level, and if ever there was a time to start taking the bull by the horns it's now.



We have seen precious little entertainment all season. I saw more entertainment watching us in the lower divisions at Elm Park. The club cannot expect supporters to keep turning out watching a lousy product week in week out. Plenty of ST holders including myself have missed a number of games this season in the knowledge the fare was going to be abysmal.

None of expect us to play free flowing football each week. However it is not unreasonable to expect just a tad of excitement from the most extensively assembled squad in our entire history.


I hear what you say, and almost everybody will agree with you. Does that completely excuse the total lethargy exhibited by our supporters though?


Totally.

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Re: The fans alternative course of action.

by Sebastian the Red » 23 Feb 2018 15:38

handbags_harris wrote:
I hear what you say, and almost everybody will agree with you. Does that completely excuse the total lethargy exhibited by our supporters though?


What is there to "excuse"? The supporters owe the club absolutely nothing.

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Re: The fans alternative course of action.

by Zip » 23 Feb 2018 18:46

handbags_harris wrote:
Zip wrote:
handbags_harris wrote:What Stam says about the fans from now on is irrelevant as far as I'm concerned. He's entitled to his opinion of course, but no matter how well he means the things he says, he no longer has the support of the majority which is all but a position of dead man walking.

But regardless of Stam and the way he presents his arguments (and I've been a vocal critic of many of his managerial facets), one of the biggest issues this club has had over the last few years is its supporters - we all want the same thing, we each have a different opinion on how we should reach the ultimate goal but Jesus, we don't half have a precious "the players must entertain me" mentality. The sooner people realise that we support a club that has far from a divine right to be "entertained" every single match the better. We're not Chelsea, Man Utd, or Liverpool, we don't possess the quality of player to be able to win matches from a base of supporter expectancy. We're Reading, and regardless of the club's outlay on our players those players will still need to battle, scrap and fight as much as play because the opponents we face week in week out are our equals, we are not inherently better than them. If they don't battle, scrap or show 100% on the pitch then fine, express dissatisfaction however you see fit. oxf*rd what Stam thinks, says or does, provided the players show courage and determination and give 100% on the pitch they'll have my backing regardless of whether they're playing well or not. We're far too passive and reactive a fanbase, people from other clubs literally take the piss every oxf*rd week about us, but the point of sitting on your hands and expecting to be entertained has long gone. It's easy to be positive when you're losing just twice in a 46 game season. It's easy to be positive when your team plays high intensity, free flowing football, it's easy to be positive when you win 16 from 18 matches and snatch the league title. We've had a paucity of consistently good results and performances since the last relegation but surely the time has now come for the fans to realise that we need to do what we can to help? Because at the moment, we're not, we're exacerbating a shit situation. We know we're not going to be entertained by the sterile dross that's on display but we can at least try to make a difference and liven up the performances. It's up to us to do what we can to raise the playing level, and if ever there was a time to start taking the bull by the horns it's now.



We have seen precious little entertainment all season. I saw more entertainment watching us in the lower divisions at Elm Park. The club cannot expect supporters to keep turning out watching a lousy product week in week out. Plenty of ST holders including myself have missed a number of games this season in the knowledge the fare was going to be abysmal.

None of expect us to play free flowing football each week. However it is not unreasonable to expect just a tad of excitement from the most extensively assembled squad in our entire history.


I hear what you say, and almost everybody will agree with you. Does that completely excuse the total lethargy exhibited by our supporters though?



I think the total lethargy is brought about by our style of play. I have always been brought up on the home team putting the away side under pressure from the opening stages of the game. That gets the fans going. Under Stam we start slowly and it allows the opposition to find their feet. In the absence of much happening on the pitch we all go quiet.

As a fanbase generally we are a bit reserved. Not always. When we play say a West Ham managed by Pardew or a Wolves managed by McGhee we are much more engaged. Or when we know we are up against it, ie Fulham in the play offs. Generally though we are not particularly vociferous and it was noticeable how much more noise Huddersfield supporters made than us in the play off final.

It’s a double edged sword though. We are not particularly vocal when things go pear shaped. Yes there are some boos but the vast majority of us are pretty quiet and don’t have a go at the players and management. I can’t help but feel though that Stam has not helped. He is very aloof and makes no attempt to engage with the supporters. It’s cold and detached. So when we are struggling he receives a collective shrug of the shoulders.

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Re: The fans alternative course of action.

by Eaststandman » 24 Feb 2018 13:21

JS appears to be contemptuous of the no nothing fan plebs!
The game is tribal, we are having a rules governed conflict with the opposition, both on and off the pitch!
It is a results based business our results are poor!
Our methods, attitude, ability and effectiveness are poor!
The frustration is palpable, fans are stuck with the club they support and pay emotionally, financially and the players and managers get paid to succeed!
Make no mistake, the football club are not satisfying the demands of it's customers, however nuanced your particular opinion may be!

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Re: The fans alternative course of action.

by double d » 24 Feb 2018 13:57

Shut up you melt

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Re: The fans alternative course of action.

by Ascotexgunner » 25 Feb 2018 22:13

Im resigned to the fact that even if we stay up on goal difference Stam will be there next season. Nothing will change.

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