Back from the game - Norwich

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Re: Back from the game - Norwich

by NewCorkSeth » 17 Mar 2018 22:57

Norfolk Royal wrote:Lost that one in the first half really with goals from two corners and a penalty the result of a lethargic and mistake strewn first half hour. Great improvement in the second half and by the end Norwich were hanging on and wasting time. An equaliser would have been deserved in the circumstances.

Jaakola - 4 - Didn't have a lot to do but what he did do looked a bit haphazard, Was responsible for the penalty with an ugly hack on Maddison who was trying to round him. Some people around me were convinced Maddison had handled it to push the ball around Jaakola but would have to look at that again. Distribution was adequate but not convincing.

Gunter- 6 - Decent display from him. Got to the byline a couple of times in the second half and put in decent balls. Appeared frustrated that his 'runs' were not being picked up by the others. Couple of Norwich fans I spoke to thought he was our best player.

Blackett - 3.5 - Could have been sent off for a reckless two footed tackle and got the benefit of the doubt from the ref, probably rightly but it was touch and go. He ain't a left back, I'll leave it at that.

Moore - 5.5 - Always looks decent quality but surely two goals from corners is at least in part down to him as the main central defender.

Llori - 3 - Wasted possession, particularly one free kick, and looked dodgy on the ball.

Clement - 5 - Poor in first half but grew into the game. Lacks a bit of composure at times, and pace, but likes a tackle. I'd persist with him a bit on that showing as could become a crowd favourite but would have to up his game 20 per cent to do that.

Kelly - 6.5 - Arguably MOM for us until he was bizarrely substituted earlyish in the second half. He was about the only player who had a good first half and then I think laid on the goal for Smith with good cross behind the defence. Fans didn't like it when he was hoiked off chanting 'You don't know what you're doing' at Stam. if his substitution was down to an injury fair enough but inexplicable otherwise. That said, when he did go off and JVDB and Swift came on, we did look more compact in midfield and threatened more.

Aluko - 3 - Oh dear. When he receives the ball he always seems to have about three defenders around him. I think that is because he is too obvious and ponderous when he tries to evade the challenges rather than the opposition having him down as someone to mark closely. Just didn't add any value to our performance really.

Edwards - 4 - Didn't really notice him much but played his part in the second half improvement. At least I think he did as he was at least on the pitch at the time.

Barrow - 5.5 - I suspect that wasn't one of his better games but did look dangerous occasionally.

Smith - 5 - Looked out of his depth in the first half and it was a big ask for him today against Grant Hanley and Timm Klose, two experienced centre halfs. But took his goal well, a decent knack to have, and pulled the Norwich defence apart several times with good off the ball running. Again, worth persisting with.

Subs:

Swift: - 6 - Player of skill and some decent passing patterns but perhaps should have driven forward a bit more considering the state of the game when he came on.

JVDB - 5 - One shocker of a ball to Gunter easily cut out by the Norwich defender when we were in a good position but appeared to exert some sort of control on the midfield after coming on.


Ref: The usual shocker, the most blatant being that surely he should have sent Jaakola off for his foul on Maddison. It clearly denied him a goalscoring opportunity. Did not add on enough time at the end for Norwich's frequent time wasting.

Fans: Not bad, about 450 to 500 I would say. When we got a goal back in the first half there was a decent chorus of 'How shit must you be, we've just scored a goal,' although negative chanting as a highlight is perhaps pushing it a bit. Few 'Stam out chants' but far from everybody chanting it. Gallows humour but largely supportive of the efforts the players made, particularly second half.

I usually like your posts but 8 could read past the misspelling of Ilori. It's an I. It's on the back of his shirt. C'mon.

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Re: Back from the game - Norwich

by Norfolk Royal » 17 Mar 2018 23:00

Huckleberry Hound wrote:Current law states:

Where a player commits an offence against an opponent within their own penalty area which denies an opponent an obvious goal-scoring opportunity and the referee awards a penalty kick, the offending player is cautioned if the offence was an attempt to play the ball; in all other circumstances (e.g. holding, pulling, pushing, no possibility to play the ball etc.) the offending player must be sent off.

So the ref obviously believed he was attempting to play the ball.


Thanks for explaining, that as I wasn't aware of it.

It might help though if the referees were consistent in applying that rule.

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Re: Back from the game - Norwich

by Norfolk Royal » 17 Mar 2018 23:03

NewCorkSeth wrote:
Norfolk Royal wrote:Lost that one in the first half really with goals from two corners and a penalty the result of a lethargic and mistake strewn first half hour. Great improvement in the second half and by the end Norwich were hanging on and wasting time. An equaliser would have been deserved in the circumstances.

Jaakola - 4 - Didn't have a lot to do but what he did do looked a bit haphazard, Was responsible for the penalty with an ugly hack on Maddison who was trying to round him. Some people around me were convinced Maddison had handled it to push the ball around Jaakola but would have to look at that again. Distribution was adequate but not convincing.

Gunter- 6 - Decent display from him. Got to the byline a couple of times in the second half and put in decent balls. Appeared frustrated that his 'runs' were not being picked up by the others. Couple of Norwich fans I spoke to thought he was our best player.

Blackett - 3.5 - Could have been sent off for a reckless two footed tackle and got the benefit of the doubt from the ref, probably rightly but it was touch and go. He ain't a left back, I'll leave it at that.

Moore - 5.5 - Always looks decent quality but surely two goals from corners is at least in part down to him as the main central defender.

Llori - 3 - Wasted possession, particularly one free kick, and looked dodgy on the ball.

Clement - 5 - Poor in first half but grew into the game. Lacks a bit of composure at times, and pace, but likes a tackle. I'd persist with him a bit on that showing as could become a crowd favourite but would have to up his game 20 per cent to do that.

Kelly - 6.5 - Arguably MOM for us until he was bizarrely substituted earlyish in the second half. He was about the only player who had a good first half and then I think laid on the goal for Smith with good cross behind the defence. Fans didn't like it when he was hoiked off chanting 'You don't know what you're doing' at Stam. if his substitution was down to an injury fair enough but inexplicable otherwise. That said, when he did go off and JVDB and Swift came on, we did look more compact in midfield and threatened more.

Aluko - 3 - Oh dear. When he receives the ball he always seems to have about three defenders around him. I think that is because he is too obvious and ponderous when he tries to evade the challenges rather than the opposition having him down as someone to mark closely. Just didn't add any value to our performance really.

Edwards - 4 - Didn't really notice him much but played his part in the second half improvement. At least I think he did as he was at least on the pitch at the time.

Barrow - 5.5 - I suspect that wasn't one of his better games but did look dangerous occasionally.

Smith - 5 - Looked out of his depth in the first half and it was a big ask for him today against Grant Hanley and Timm Klose, two experienced centre halfs. But took his goal well, a decent knack to have, and pulled the Norwich defence apart several times with good off the ball running. Again, worth persisting with.

Subs:

Swift: - 6 - Player of skill and some decent passing patterns but perhaps should have driven forward a bit more considering the state of the game when he came on.

JVDB - 5 - One shocker of a ball to Gunter easily cut out by the Norwich defender when we were in a good position but appeared to exert some sort of control on the midfield after coming on.


Ref: The usual shocker, the most blatant being that surely he should have sent Jaakola off for his foul on Maddison. It clearly denied him a goalscoring opportunity. Did not add on enough time at the end for Norwich's frequent time wasting.

Fans: Not bad, about 450 to 500 I would say. When we got a goal back in the first half there was a decent chorus of 'How shit must you be, we've just scored a goal,' although negative chanting as a highlight is perhaps pushing it a bit. Few 'Stam out chants' but far from everybody chanting it. Gallows humour but largely supportive of the efforts the players made, particularly second half.

I usually like your posts but 8 could read past the misspelling of Ilori. It's an I. It's on the back of his shirt. C'mon.


Ha, I guessed his name as couldn't be arsed to look it up and have never heard anyone saying it. Sorry.

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Re: Back from the game - Norwich

by Norfolk Royal » 17 Mar 2018 23:03

NewCorkSeth wrote:
Norfolk Royal wrote:Lost that one in the first half really with goals from two corners and a penalty the result of a lethargic and mistake strewn first half hour. Great improvement in the second half and by the end Norwich were hanging on and wasting time. An equaliser would have been deserved in the circumstances.

Jaakola - 4 - Didn't have a lot to do but what he did do looked a bit haphazard, Was responsible for the penalty with an ugly hack on Maddison who was trying to round him. Some people around me were convinced Maddison had handled it to push the ball around Jaakola but would have to look at that again. Distribution was adequate but not convincing.

Gunter- 6 - Decent display from him. Got to the byline a couple of times in the second half and put in decent balls. Appeared frustrated that his 'runs' were not being picked up by the others. Couple of Norwich fans I spoke to thought he was our best player.

Blackett - 3.5 - Could have been sent off for a reckless two footed tackle and got the benefit of the doubt from the ref, probably rightly but it was touch and go. He ain't a left back, I'll leave it at that.

Moore - 5.5 - Always looks decent quality but surely two goals from corners is at least in part down to him as the main central defender.

Llori - 3 - Wasted possession, particularly one free kick, and looked dodgy on the ball.

Clement - 5 - Poor in first half but grew into the game. Lacks a bit of composure at times, and pace, but likes a tackle. I'd persist with him a bit on that showing as could become a crowd favourite but would have to up his game 20 per cent to do that.

Kelly - 6.5 - Arguably MOM for us until he was bizarrely substituted earlyish in the second half. He was about the only player who had a good first half and then I think laid on the goal for Smith with good cross behind the defence. Fans didn't like it when he was hoiked off chanting 'You don't know what you're doing' at Stam. if his substitution was down to an injury fair enough but inexplicable otherwise. That said, when he did go off and JVDB and Swift came on, we did look more compact in midfield and threatened more.

Aluko - 3 - Oh dear. When he receives the ball he always seems to have about three defenders around him. I think that is because he is too obvious and ponderous when he tries to evade the challenges rather than the opposition having him down as someone to mark closely. Just didn't add any value to our performance really.

Edwards - 4 - Didn't really notice him much but played his part in the second half improvement. At least I think he did as he was at least on the pitch at the time.

Barrow - 5.5 - I suspect that wasn't one of his better games but did look dangerous occasionally.

Smith - 5 - Looked out of his depth in the first half and it was a big ask for him today against Grant Hanley and Timm Klose, two experienced centre halfs. But took his goal well, a decent knack to have, and pulled the Norwich defence apart several times with good off the ball running. Again, worth persisting with.

Subs:

Swift: - 6 - Player of skill and some decent passing patterns but perhaps should have driven forward a bit more considering the state of the game when he came on.

JVDB - 5 - One shocker of a ball to Gunter easily cut out by the Norwich defender when we were in a good position but appeared to exert some sort of control on the midfield after coming on.


Ref: The usual shocker, the most blatant being that surely he should have sent Jaakola off for his foul on Maddison. It clearly denied him a goalscoring opportunity. Did not add on enough time at the end for Norwich's frequent time wasting.

Fans: Not bad, about 450 to 500 I would say. When we got a goal back in the first half there was a decent chorus of 'How shit must you be, we've just scored a goal,' although negative chanting as a highlight is perhaps pushing it a bit. Few 'Stam out chants' but far from everybody chanting it. Gallows humour but largely supportive of the efforts the players made, particularly second half.

I usually like your posts but 8 could read past the misspelling of Ilori. It's an I. It's on the back of his shirt. C'mon.


Ha, I guessed his name as couldn't be arsed to look it up and have never heard anyone saying it. Sorry. No doubt you're correct that his name is on the back of his shirt, unfortunately I was not close enough to examine the spelling.

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Re: Back from the game - Norwich

by double d » 18 Mar 2018 08:51

genome wrote:I wonder if John Smith thinks we're in a relegation battle yet?


John Smith wrote:


???


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Re: Back from the game - Norwich

by Platypuss » 18 Mar 2018 13:39

Norfolk Royal wrote:Ref: The usual shocker, the most blatant being that surely he should have sent Jaakola off for his foul on Maddison. It clearly denied him a goalscoring opportunity. Did not add on enough time at the end for Norwich's frequent time wasting.


If Jaakola was making a genuine attempt to play the ball then a yellow is correct.

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Re: Back from the game - Norwich

by strap » 18 Mar 2018 15:49

tidus_mi2 wrote:Dellor was claiming Jakkola was lucky not to be sent off too but remember that they changed the rule on that, if a player makes a genuine attempt to win the ball, it is not a sending off offence.

Now I haven't seen Jakkola's foul for the penalty but if he genuinely went for the ball, the referee made the correct decision.


Looking at a few times on Youtube and I really question whether it was even a penalty. Both players seemingly went for the ball and took each other out, with the ball spinning well away from the NCFC player in any event. Academic really I suppose.

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Re: Back from the game - Norwich

by Denver Royal » 18 Mar 2018 16:31

strap wrote:
tidus_mi2 wrote:Dellor was claiming Jakkola was lucky not to be sent off too but remember that they changed the rule on that, if a player makes a genuine attempt to win the ball, it is not a sending off offence.

Now I haven't seen Jakkola's foul for the penalty but if he genuinely went for the ball, the referee made the correct decision.


Looking at a few times on Youtube and I really question whether it was even a penalty. Both players seemingly went for the ball and took each other out, with the ball spinning well away from the NCFC player in any event. Academic really I suppose.


You may have a point there, Strap. Watching the clip from behind the goal closely, it looks to me like Jaakola actually palms the ball away, or certainly gets a hand on the ball anyway. And that seems to be what he is saying, by holding his hand up, when pleading his case with the ref. (Although, its easy to see why a ref would have given a foul and yellow there, esp. with Maddison writhing in agony one second, he looks up to see the ref has given it, and then jumps to his feet seconds later, and then takes/scores the penalty).

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Re: Back from the game - Norwich

by tilehurstender » 18 Mar 2018 16:48

Agree with most of points raised apart from I thought Gunter got absolutely roasted time and time again. Illoris lack of even getting off the ground for their second goal was horrendous and summed up his whole attitude to this relegation fight.
Regarding the penalty, if I was Stam I'd be more concerned why Maddison was left totally unmarked in acres of space which led to the challenge.
I know it's been mentioned before but surely the one thing we should expect from having a manager who was a world class defender is to have a defence that can at least do the basics when it comes to corners and set pieces?


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Re: Back from the game - Norwich

by Denver Royal » 18 Mar 2018 16:52

Norfolk, excellent write up, thanks for that. I agree with most all of your player ratings, too. Does Maddison look like a PL player to you? Read somewhere recently he is rated at 30mil!?

tilehurstender, yep Ilori continues his masquerade as a center half in the Champ. You wonder if game plans by opposing managers ever get exotic. More like...'Lump crosses in to their middle...create mayhem and havoc...their center half Ilori is weak in the air...should be easy pickings...you will have opportunities'. Yesterday, they had already scored their 1st from a header from a corner. Their 2nd goal, a routine corner, send up their defenders, Hanley engulfs Ilori, a complete mismatch.

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Re: Back from the game - Norwich

by Awayawayaway » 18 Mar 2018 17:04

Denver Royal wrote:Norfolk, excellent write up, thanks for that. I agree with most all of your player ratings, too. Does Maddison look like a PL player to you? Read somewhere recently he is rated at 30mil!?

tilehurstender, yep Ilori continues his masquerade as a center half in the Champ. You wonder if game plans by opposing managers ever get exotic. More like...'Lump crosses in to their middle...create mayhem and havoc...their center half Ilori is weak in the air...should be easy pickings...you will have opportunities'. Yesterday, they had already scored their 1st from a header from a corner. Their 2nd goal, a routine corner, send up their defenders, Hanley engulfs Ilori, a complete mismatch.


What was the atmosphere like, Denver?

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Re: Back from the game - Norwich

by Denver Royal » 18 Mar 2018 17:44

Awayawayaway wrote:
Denver Royal wrote:Norfolk, excellent write up, thanks for that. I agree with most all of your player ratings, too. Does Maddison look like a PL player to you? Read somewhere recently he is rated at 30mil!?

tilehurstender, yep Ilori continues his masquerade as a center half in the Champ. You wonder if game plans by opposing managers ever get exotic. More like...'Lump crosses in to their middle...create mayhem and havoc...their center half Ilori is weak in the air...should be easy pickings...you will have opportunities'. Yesterday, they had already scored their 1st from a header from a corner. Their 2nd goal, a routine corner, send up their defenders, Hanley engulfs Ilori, a complete mismatch.


What was the atmosphere like, Denver?


Norfolk sums it up for you, first post on this thread.

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Re: Back from the game - Norwich

by Awayawayaway » 18 Mar 2018 17:48

Denver Royal wrote:
Awayawayaway wrote:
Denver Royal wrote:Norfolk, excellent write up, thanks for that. I agree with most all of your player ratings, too. Does Maddison look like a PL player to you? Read somewhere recently he is rated at 30mil!?

tilehurstender, yep Ilori continues his masquerade as a center half in the Champ. You wonder if game plans by opposing managers ever get exotic. More like...'Lump crosses in to their middle...create mayhem and havoc...their center half Ilori is weak in the air...should be easy pickings...you will have opportunities'. Yesterday, they had already scored their 1st from a header from a corner. Their 2nd goal, a routine corner, send up their defenders, Hanley engulfs Ilori, a complete mismatch.


What was the atmosphere like, Denver?


Norfolk sums it up for you, first post on this thread.


Ah ok, some people see things differently thats all. Did you have a good day out?


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Re: Back from the game - Norwich

by Denver Royal » 18 Mar 2018 17:52

Awayawayaway wrote:
Denver Royal wrote:
Awayawayaway wrote:
What was the atmosphere like, Denver?


Norfolk sums it up for you, first post on this thread.


Ah ok, some people see things differently thats all. Did you have a good day out?


Yeah, I did, thanks.

And now a question for you, if I may. What was your former name(s) in here?

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Re: Back from the game - Norwich

by Whitley » 18 Mar 2018 18:06

I know its a little late for my review, but finally back from Norfolk now.

We were unlucky not to get a point after gifting them 2 maybe even 3 easy goals.

First goal how was the man unmarked at the back post following the flick on from the corner? Somebody lost their man.
Second goal, Ilori didn't even get off the ground way too easy for Hanley to score a simple goal.
Third goal, where the oxford was Tyler Blackett? Tucked far too central thinking he is playing as a Centre Back leaving Madison completely free in what should have been Blacketts position.


Jaakola - 4 In my opinion at fault for the second goal should've claimed the corner, was unlucky to have a penalty given against him.

Gunter- 5 - Got consistently beaten by his man all game, a few crosses into the Norwich box.

Blackett - 3 - Looked every bit a centre back playing left back, lucky not to be sent off, at fault for 3rd goal. Seemed to be surprisingly high up the pitch when we had the ball in attack , often ahead of winger Barrow.

Moore - 5 - Not much to say, played Ok but we conceded 3 goals.

Illori - 4- Beaten in the air for the second goal, looked poor.

Clement - 5.5 - Worked hard but no end product, made some good tackles

Kelly - 6 - Scored a goal, looked good in midfield surprisingly substituted by Stam to boos by Reading fans.

Aluko - 5 - Played Ok compared to other performers, tried to make things happen and Barrow should've been substituted instead imo.

Edwards - 4 - Didn't even realise he was on the pitch

Barrow - 5 - Poor game by his standards. First player down the tunnel after the final whistle.

Smith - 5 - Had a tough afternoon, but scored a goal and could've got another

Ref: Referee made many mistakes, including some comical ones where Kermorgant clearly deflected the ball out and he gave a goal kick. Didn't crack down on time wasting, not convinced it was a penalty.

Fans : Decent amount of Reading fans in attendance, disappointed to hear boos/Jaap Stam out chants during the game, its not been a good season but during the game this helps nobody. Go to the game and support the team.

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Re: Back from the game - Norwich

by Sutekh » 18 Mar 2018 18:36

tidus_mi2 wrote:Dellor was claiming Jakkola was lucky not to be sent off too but remember that they changed the rule on that, if a player makes a genuine attempt to win the ball, it is not a sending off offence.

Now I haven't seen Jakkola's foul for the penalty but if he genuinely went for the ball, the referee made the correct decision.


I find it unbelievable that Stam has managed to now make the goalkeeping position a problem whereas before it wasn’t

But then I remembered that it’s this season and Stam’s the manager...

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Re: Back from the game - Norwich

by Zip » 18 Mar 2018 19:47

Sutekh wrote:
tidus_mi2 wrote:Dellor was claiming Jakkola was lucky not to be sent off too but remember that they changed the rule on that, if a player makes a genuine attempt to win the ball, it is not a sending off offence.

Now I haven't seen Jakkola's foul for the penalty but if he genuinely went for the ball, the referee made the correct decision.


I find it unbelievable that Stam has managed to now make the goalkeeping position a problem whereas before it wasn’t

But then I remembered that it’s this season and Stam’s the manager...



I have to say I thought Mannone was struggling. He has been getting stick at the Mad Stad especially for playing goalkicks short and his confidence looks shot. However he is better than Jaakkola.

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Re: Back from the game - Norwich

by Snowflake Royal » 18 Mar 2018 20:27

Zip wrote:
Sutekh wrote:
tidus_mi2 wrote:Dellor was claiming Jakkola was lucky not to be sent off too but remember that they changed the rule on that, if a player makes a genuine attempt to win the ball, it is not a sending off offence.

Now I haven't seen Jakkola's foul for the penalty but if he genuinely went for the ball, the referee made the correct decision.


I find it unbelievable that Stam has managed to now make the goalkeeping position a problem whereas before it wasn’t

But then I remembered that it’s this season and Stam’s the manager...



I have to say I thought Mannone was struggling. He has been getting stick at the Mad Stad especially for playing goalkicks short and his confidence looks shot. However he is better than Jaakkola.

I'd agree with that. :P

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Re: Back from the game - Norwich

by Snowflake Royal » 18 Mar 2018 21:01

Whitley wrote:I know its a little late for my review, but finally back from Norfolk now.

We were unlucky not to get a point after gifting them 2 maybe even 3 easy goals.

First goal how was the man unmarked at the back post following the flick on from the corner? Somebody lost their man.
Second goal, Ilori didn't even get off the ground way too easy for Hanley to score a simple goal.
Third goal, where the oxford was Tyler Blackett? Tucked far too central thinking he is playing as a Centre Back leaving Madison completely free in what should have been Blacketts position.


Jaakola - 4 In my opinion at fault for the second goal should've claimed the corner, was unlucky to have a penalty given against him.

Gunter- 5 - Got consistently beaten by his man all game, a few crosses into the Norwich box.

Blackett - 3 - Looked every bit a centre back playing left back, lucky not to be sent off, at fault for 3rd goal. Seemed to be surprisingly high up the pitch when we had the ball in attack , often ahead of winger Barrow.

Moore - 5 - Not much to say, played Ok but we conceded 3 goals.

Illori - 4- Beaten in the air for the second goal, looked poor.

Clement - 5.5 - Worked hard but no end product, made some good tackles

Kelly - 6 - Scored a goal, looked good in midfield surprisingly substituted by Stam to boos by Reading fans.

Aluko - 5 - Played Ok compared to other performers, tried to make things happen and Barrow should've been substituted instead imo.

Edwards - 4 - Didn't even realise he was on the pitch

Barrow - 5 - Poor game by his standards. First player down the tunnel after the final whistle.

Smith - 5 - Had a tough afternoon, but scored a goal and could've got another

Ref: Referee made many mistakes, including some comical ones where Kermorgant clearly deflected the ball out and he gave a goal kick. Didn't crack down on time wasting, not convinced it was a penalty.

Fans : Decent amount of Reading fans in attendance, disappointed to hear boos/Jaap Stam out chants during the game, its not been a good season but during the game this helps nobody. Go to the game and support the team.

Having just seen the goals, not sure I could agree Blackett did anything wrong on the third, Moore and Gunter were nowhere, Ilori was at right back, Edwards wasn't goal side. He had to tuck in, although obviously should never have needed to if the defence was actually set properly... no one backing him up being the problem.

Completely agree on the other two though, looked like Edwards who lost the back stick for the first.

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Re: Back from the game - Norwich

by 2 world wars, 1 world cup » 18 Mar 2018 23:36

I see a lot of negativity here.

If we put in a good second half away from home, fought hard to claw back two goals within a goal of getting an away point that can't be a bad thing surely.

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