BFTG - Bolton

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Elm Park Kid
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Re: BFTG - Bolton

by Elm Park Kid » 19 Aug 2018 14:29

Good to see the usual level of patience and perspective from the Reading fans on here :D :roll:

I'm a pessimistic fan, always have been. I thought that our squad was poor before the summer dealings and not a lot better afterwards. So I wasn't expecting much from this season to begin with. Clement has his work cut out and there is nothing that anyone can do that is going to turn things around overnight. I'm happy to wait until October/November and see how the team is getting on - for me this is all still about giving the team time to develop.

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Re: BFTG - Bolton

by Ascotexgunner » 19 Aug 2018 18:47

Elm Park Kid wrote:Good to see the usual level of patience and perspective from the Reading fans on here :D :roll:

I'm a pessimistic fan, always have been. I thought that our squad was poor before the summer dealings and not a lot better afterwards. So I wasn't expecting much from this season to begin with. Clement has his work cut out and there is nothing that anyone can do that is going to turn things around overnight. I'm happy to wait until October/November and see how the team is getting on - for me this is all still about giving the team time to develop.


Seriously? By then the team will be on its knees and pretty much on its way to league 1. We are worse than last year and even Clements signings are now looking ropey. 5 million for Baldock is looking a worse deal than Aluko. When your at the next game look around you at the stadium. Empty seats, empty boxes, advertising that's vanished, shirt sponsers that are no longer on the shirts. The problem is a lot deeper than the clueless manager we have in charge. Our CEO has worked for Chelsea and ManU....clubs that have money thrown at them, he's never ever run a club like ours where you have to work hard for it, and it shows. As for the owner......well.....that really could be nail in our coffin. He's making the Venkys look decent with his behaviour. And let's be honest here, Blackburn and Wigan had a plan b when they went down and have bounced back stronger. We don't have the brains in this club to even contemplate that eventuality, let alone prepare for it. I really really fear for this clubs future at the minute, financially and on the field.

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Re: BFTG - Bolton

by AthleticoSpizz » 19 Aug 2018 19:43

On Moore?

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Re: BFTG - Bolton

by Denver Royal » 19 Aug 2018 20:03

Ascotexgunner wrote:
Elm Park Kid wrote:Good to see the usual level of patience and perspective from the Reading fans on here :D :roll:

I'm a pessimistic fan, always have been. I thought that our squad was poor before the summer dealings and not a lot better afterwards. So I wasn't expecting much from this season to begin with. Clement has his work cut out and there is nothing that anyone can do that is going to turn things around overnight. I'm happy to wait until October/November and see how the team is getting on - for me this is all still about giving the team time to develop.


Seriously? By then the team will be on its knees and pretty much on its way to league 1. We are worse than last year and even Clements signings are now looking ropey. 5 million for Baldock is looking a worse deal than Aluko. When your at the next game look around you at the stadium. Empty seats, empty boxes, advertising that's vanished, shirt sponsers that are no longer on the shirts. The problem is a lot deeper than the clueless manager we have in charge. Our CEO has worked for Chelsea and ManU....clubs that have money thrown at them, he's never ever run a club like ours where you have to work hard for it, and it shows. As for the owner......well.....that really could be nail in our coffin. He's making the Venkys look decent with his behaviour. And let's be honest here, Blackburn and Wigan had a plan b when they went down and have bounced back stronger. We don't have the brains in this club to even contemplate that eventuality, let alone prepare for it. I really really fear for this clubs future at the minute, financially and on the field.


We wouldn't want to bounce straight back. It would be a 5 year plan, remember? :wink:

But seriously, re. League 1, doubt RG and BT have the nous for that, and they would not relish working there (nor would Clement, for that matter). So, if we drop, suspect it would all be 'chop and change', regardless.

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Re: BFTG - Bolton

by Victor Meldrew » 19 Aug 2018 20:13

Not much more to add but FWIW I am in the Swift camp rather than Kelly.
Kelly seems to have gone backwards since he decided he wanted to be an English international rather than an Irish one and his booking was pathetic by behaving like a little kid when he himself did not get a fee-kick.

I think people were expecting more after the Brum game and didn't take into account that it was their reserves with just one player retained from the previous Saturday.

On individuals, I thought that McShane and Moore hardly won a header.
Yiadom was off form.
Blackett's positional sense , especially in the first half ,was terrible-how can he be so unaware of what goes on around him when he actually played for Man Utd's first team as a youngster.?
Meyler- one step up from Joey which isn't saying much.
Baldock showed promise.
McNulty was too casual with ball retention.
Meite looks like the kind of forward that a lot of Div 1 and 2 clubs have-not particularly good at any aspect of the game but a good trier.
Popa's reputation has improved by not playing-he is still not very good.

I think Meite sums up how we are now.
It feels as though the players are trying more than they did last season but trying isn't enough.
These are mainly moderate players for this level with the exception of Barrow, and Moore on one of his better days.
I don't know who is really responsible for recruitment but whoever it is (BT, Gourlay and/ or Clement) needs to pull a few rabbits out of the hat before the loan window closes as I feel that this is destined to be as big a struggle as last season with , so far , no great step up in quality.

Nathan Dyer for starters plus at least 2 or 3 more are essential IMHO.


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Re: BFTG - Bolton

by Ascotexgunner » 19 Aug 2018 20:16

Denver Royal wrote:
Ascotexgunner wrote:
Elm Park Kid wrote:Good to see the usual level of patience and perspective from the Reading fans on here :D :roll:

I'm a pessimistic fan, always have been. I thought that our squad was poor before the summer dealings and not a lot better afterwards. So I wasn't expecting much from this season to begin with. Clement has his work cut out and there is nothing that anyone can do that is going to turn things around overnight. I'm happy to wait until October/November and see how the team is getting on - for me this is all still about giving the team time to develop.


Seriously? By then the team will be on its knees and pretty much on its way to league 1. We are worse than last year and even Clements signings are now looking ropey. 5 million for Baldock is looking a worse deal than Aluko. When your at the next game look around you at the stadium. Empty seats, empty boxes, advertising that's vanished, shirt sponsers that are no longer on the shirts. The problem is a lot deeper than the clueless manager we have in charge. Our CEO has worked for Chelsea and ManU....clubs that have money thrown at them, he's never ever run a club like ours where you have to work hard for it, and it shows. As for the owner......well.....that really could be nail in our coffin. He's making the Venkys look decent with his behaviour. And let's be honest here, Blackburn and Wigan had a plan b when they went down and have bounced back stronger. We don't have the brains in this club to even contemplate that eventuality, let alone prepare for it. I really really fear for this clubs future at the minute, financially and on the field.


We wouldn't want to bounce straight back. It would be a 5 year plan, remember? :wink:

But seriously, re. League 1, doubt RG and BT have the nous for that, and they would not relish working there (nor would Clement, for that matter). So, if we drop, suspect it would all be 'chop and change', regardless.


HaHa :D I forgot the 5 year plan. Oh my god 5 years of this......
You know......and I hate to say this......maybe we do need to go down for something to change. But as I say we don't appear to think like other clubs and it will probably be catastrophic?

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Re: BFTG - Bolton

by Snowflake Royal » 19 Aug 2018 20:18

Ascotexgunner wrote:
Elm Park Kid wrote:Good to see the usual level of patience and perspective from the Reading fans on here :D :roll:

I'm a pessimistic fan, always have been. I thought that our squad was poor before the summer dealings and not a lot better afterwards. So I wasn't expecting much from this season to begin with. Clement has his work cut out and there is nothing that anyone can do that is going to turn things around overnight. I'm happy to wait until October/November and see how the team is getting on - for me this is all still about giving the team time to develop.


Seriously? By then the team will be on its knees and pretty much on its way to league 1. We are worse than last year and even Clements signings are now looking ropey. 5 million for Baldock is looking a worse deal than Aluko. When your at the next game look around you at the stadium. Empty seats, empty boxes, advertising that's vanished, shirt sponsers that are no longer on the shirts. The problem is a lot deeper than the clueless manager we have in charge. Our CEO has worked for Chelsea and ManU....clubs that have money thrown at them, he's never ever run a club like ours where you have to work hard for it, and it shows. As for the owner......well.....that really could be nail in our coffin. He's making the Venkys look decent with his behaviour. And let's be honest here, Blackburn and Wigan had a plan b when they went down and have bounced back stronger. We don't have the brains in this club to even contemplate that eventuality, let alone prepare for it. I really really fear for this clubs future at the minute, financially and on the field.

As Kes would say, calm down to a panic mate.

We are not worse than last year. Baldock doesn't look anything like as bad a signing as Aluko and I certainly don't recall seeing £5m bandied about for him.

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Re: BFTG - Bolton

by Ascotexgunner » 19 Aug 2018 20:26

Snowflake Royal wrote:
Ascotexgunner wrote:
Elm Park Kid wrote:Good to see the usual level of patience and perspective from the Reading fans on here :D :roll:

I'm a pessimistic fan, always have been. I thought that our squad was poor before the summer dealings and not a lot better afterwards. So I wasn't expecting much from this season to begin with. Clement has his work cut out and there is nothing that anyone can do that is going to turn things around overnight. I'm happy to wait until October/November and see how the team is getting on - for me this is all still about giving the team time to develop.


Seriously? By then the team will be on its knees and pretty much on its way to league 1. We are worse than last year and even Clements signings are now looking ropey. 5 million for Baldock is looking a worse deal than Aluko. When your at the next game look around you at the stadium. Empty seats, empty boxes, advertising that's vanished, shirt sponsers that are no longer on the shirts. The problem is a lot deeper than the clueless manager we have in charge. Our CEO has worked for Chelsea and ManU....clubs that have money thrown at them, he's never ever run a club like ours where you have to work hard for it, and it shows. As for the owner......well.....that really could be nail in our coffin. He's making the Venkys look decent with his behaviour. And let's be honest here, Blackburn and Wigan had a plan b when they went down and have bounced back stronger. We don't have the brains in this club to even contemplate that eventuality, let alone prepare for it. I really really fear for this clubs future at the minute, financially and on the field.

As Kes would say, calm down to a panic mate.

We are not worse than last year. Baldock doesn't look anything like as bad a signing as Aluko and I certainly don't recall seeing £5m bandied about for him.


5 mil was the figure Tim Dellor quoted.

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Re: BFTG - Bolton

by Elm Park Kid » 19 Aug 2018 21:57

Ascotexgunner wrote:
Snowflake Royal wrote:
Ascotexgunner wrote:
Seriously? By then the team will be on its knees and pretty much on its way to league 1. We are worse than last year and even Clements signings are now looking ropey. 5 million for Baldock is looking a worse deal than Aluko. When your at the next game look around you at the stadium. Empty seats, empty boxes, advertising that's vanished, shirt sponsers that are no longer on the shirts. The problem is a lot deeper than the clueless manager we have in charge. Our CEO has worked for Chelsea and ManU....clubs that have money thrown at them, he's never ever run a club like ours where you have to work hard for it, and it shows. As for the owner......well.....that really could be nail in our coffin. He's making the Venkys look decent with his behaviour. And let's be honest here, Blackburn and Wigan had a plan b when they went down and have bounced back stronger. We don't have the brains in this club to even contemplate that eventuality, let alone prepare for it. I really really fear for this clubs future at the minute, financially and on the field.

As Kes would say, calm down to a panic mate.

We are not worse than last year. Baldock doesn't look anything like as bad a signing as Aluko and I certainly don't recall seeing £5m bandied about for him.


5 mil was the figure Tim Dellor quoted.


So - shock when player doesn't perform amazing in first few games at new club?

I don't disagree with your analysis; I think that the series of owners we've had has steadily worn away the spirit at the club and fan support. Our spending hasn't been ridiculously low for our level, but neither has it been high. Without either a plan to build stability and confidence, or spending £30m+ there's not a lot you can do. The first one needs fans to back the club though and managers beyond 11 games. You need to look at the long term and not jump to conclusions 3 weeks into a season.

It's that thinking that got McDermott fired the second time and the reason we are here now . .. . . .


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Re: BFTG - Bolton

by Royal_jimmy » 19 Aug 2018 22:10

Denver Royal wrote:
Ascotexgunner wrote:
Elm Park Kid wrote:Good to see the usual level of patience and perspective from the Reading fans on here :D :roll:

I'm a pessimistic fan, always have been. I thought that our squad was poor before the summer dealings and not a lot better afterwards. So I wasn't expecting much from this season to begin with. Clement has his work cut out and there is nothing that anyone can do that is going to turn things around overnight. I'm happy to wait until October/November and see how the team is getting on - for me this is all still about giving the team time to develop.


Seriously? By then the team will be on its knees and pretty much on its way to league 1. We are worse than last year and even Clements signings are now looking ropey. 5 million for Baldock is looking a worse deal than Aluko. When your at the next game look around you at the stadium. Empty seats, empty boxes, advertising that's vanished, shirt sponsers that are no longer on the shirts. The problem is a lot deeper than the clueless manager we have in charge. Our CEO has worked for Chelsea and ManU....clubs that have money thrown at them, he's never ever run a club like ours where you have to work hard for it, and it shows. As for the owner......well.....that really could be nail in our coffin. He's making the Venkys look decent with his behaviour. And let's be honest here, Blackburn and Wigan had a plan b when they went down and have bounced back stronger. We don't have the brains in this club to even contemplate that eventuality, let alone prepare for it. I really really fear for this clubs future at the minute, financially and on the field.


We wouldn't want to bounce straight back. It would be a 5 year plan, remember? :wink:

But seriously, re. League 1, doubt RG and BT have the nous for that, and they would not relish working there (nor would Clement, for that matter). So, if we drop, suspect it would all be 'chop and change', regardless.


Probably what we could do with
In my opinion

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Re: BFTG - Bolton

by WAZZOCK » 19 Aug 2018 22:12

Ascotexgunner wrote:
Elm Park Kid wrote:Good to see the usual level of patience and perspective from the Reading fans on here :D :roll:

I'm a pessimistic fan, always have been. I thought that our squad was poor before the summer dealings and not a lot better afterwards. So I wasn't expecting much from this season to begin with. Clement has his work cut out and there is nothing that anyone can do that is going to turn things around overnight. I'm happy to wait until October/November and see how the team is getting on - for me this is all still about giving the team time to develop.


Seriously? By then the team will be on its knees and pretty much on its way to league 1. We are worse than last year and even Clements signings are now looking ropey. 5 million for Baldock is looking a worse deal than Aluko. When your at the next game look around you at the stadium. Empty seats, empty boxes, advertising that's vanished, shirt sponsers that are no longer on the shirts. The problem is a lot deeper than the clueless manager we have in charge. Our CEO has worked for Chelsea and ManU....clubs that have money thrown at them, he's never ever run a club like ours where you have to work hard for it, and it shows. As for the owner......well.....that really could be nail in our coffin. He's making the Venkys look decent with his behaviour. And let's be honest here, Blackburn and Wigan had a plan b when they went down and have bounced back stronger. We don't have the brains in this club to even contemplate that eventuality, let alone prepare for it. I really really fear for this clubs future at the minute, financially and on the field.


Our CEO may have worked at Man Utd and Chelsea, but he has never worked in the football side of football.

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Re: BFTG - Bolton

by WAZZOCK » 19 Aug 2018 22:14

Denver Royal wrote:
Ascotexgunner wrote:
Elm Park Kid wrote:Good to see the usual level of patience and perspective from the Reading fans on here :D :roll:

I'm a pessimistic fan, always have been. I thought that our squad was poor before the summer dealings and not a lot better afterwards. So I wasn't expecting much from this season to begin with. Clement has his work cut out and there is nothing that anyone can do that is going to turn things around overnight. I'm happy to wait until October/November and see how the team is getting on - for me this is all still about giving the team time to develop.


Seriously? By then the team will be on its knees and pretty much on its way to league 1. We are worse than last year and even Clements signings are now looking ropey. 5 million for Baldock is looking a worse deal than Aluko. When your at the next game look around you at the stadium. Empty seats, empty boxes, advertising that's vanished, shirt sponsers that are no longer on the shirts. The problem is a lot deeper than the clueless manager we have in charge. Our CEO has worked for Chelsea and ManU....clubs that have money thrown at them, he's never ever run a club like ours where you have to work hard for it, and it shows. As for the owner......well.....that really could be nail in our coffin. He's making the Venkys look decent with his behaviour. And let's be honest here, Blackburn and Wigan had a plan b when they went down and have bounced back stronger. We don't have the brains in this club to even contemplate that eventuality, let alone prepare for it. I really really fear for this clubs future at the minute, financially and on the field.


We wouldn't want to bounce straight back. It would be a 5 year plan, remember? :wink:

But seriously, re. League 1, doubt RG and BT have the nous for that, and they would not relish working there (nor would Clement, for that matter). So, if we drop, suspect it would all be 'chop and change', regardless.


If we get relegated to Lge 1 then RG would be out the door. It would be at this point that we see a much improved transfer policy under Tevereden, just like we saw in his first season in the role.

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Re: BFTG - Bolton

by Zip » 19 Aug 2018 22:20

I really dont think being relegated would be a good way to start rebuilding. There is no guarantee we would bounce back quickly and gates would drop even further. We need to try and consolidate this season with a view to being more ambitious in the following seasons.


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Re: BFTG - Bolton

by Zip » 19 Aug 2018 22:21

WAZZOCK wrote:
Denver Royal wrote:
Ascotexgunner wrote:
Seriously? By then the team will be on its knees and pretty much on its way to league 1. We are worse than last year and even Clements signings are now looking ropey. 5 million for Baldock is looking a worse deal than Aluko. When your at the next game look around you at the stadium. Empty seats, empty boxes, advertising that's vanished, shirt sponsers that are no longer on the shirts. The problem is a lot deeper than the clueless manager we have in charge. Our CEO has worked for Chelsea and ManU....clubs that have money thrown at them, he's never ever run a club like ours where you have to work hard for it, and it shows. As for the owner......well.....that really could be nail in our coffin. He's making the Venkys look decent with his behaviour. And let's be honest here, Blackburn and Wigan had a plan b when they went down and have bounced back stronger. We don't have the brains in this club to even contemplate that eventuality, let alone prepare for it. I really really fear for this clubs future at the minute, financially and on the field.


We wouldn't want to bounce straight back. It would be a 5 year plan, remember? :wink:

But seriously, re. League 1, doubt RG and BT have the nous for that, and they would not relish working there (nor would Clement, for that matter). So, if we drop, suspect it would all be 'chop and change', regardless.


If we get relegated to Lge 1 then RG would be out the door. It would be at this point that we see a much improved transfer policy under Tevereden, just like we saw in his first season in the role.



How do you know this? Pure speculation.

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Re: BFTG - Bolton

by Zip » 19 Aug 2018 22:23

Victor Meldrew wrote:Not much more to add but FWIW I am in the Swift camp rather than Kelly.
Kelly seems to have gone backwards since he decided he wanted to be an English international rather than an Irish one and his booking was pathetic by behaving like a little kid when he himself did not get a fee-kick.

I think people were expecting more after the Brum game and didn't take into account that it was their reserves with just one player retained from the previous Saturday.

On individuals, I thought that McShane and Moore hardly won a header.
Yiadom was off form.
Blackett's positional sense , especially in the first half ,was terrible-how can he be so unaware of what goes on around him when he actually played for Man Utd's first team as a youngster.?
Meyler- one step up from Joey which isn't saying much.
Baldock showed promise.
McNulty was too casual with ball retention.
Meite looks like the kind of forward that a lot of Div 1 and 2 clubs have-not particularly good at any aspect of the game but a good trier.
Popa's reputation has improved by not playing-he is still not very good.

I think Meite sums up how we are now.
It feels as though the players are trying more than they did last season but trying isn't enough.
These are mainly moderate players for this level with the exception of Barrow, and Moore on one of his better days.
I don't know who is really responsible for recruitment but whoever it is (BT, Gourlay and/ or Clement) needs to pull a few rabbits out of the hat before the loan window closes as I feel that this is destined to be as big a struggle as last season with , so far , no great step up in quality.

Nathan Dyer for starters plus at least 2 or 3 more are essential IMHO.



Crikey you didn’t manage to blame Gunter for this defeat. Are you feeling ok?

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Re: BFTG - Bolton

by Lower West » 19 Aug 2018 22:41

Victor Meldrew wrote:I don't know who is really responsible for recruitment but whoever it is (BT, Gourlay and/ or Clement) needs to pull a few rabbits out of the hat before the loan window closes as I feel that this is destined to be as big a struggle as last season with , so far , no great step up in quality.



Reading aren't in the league of the big spenders. When Chelsea u21 players are going out on loan at £25k a week wages. Shows how far down the monetary league we have fallen. Not that spending money guarantees success. If Clement brings in players he has previously worked with. Then he at least has a plan in mind as to the team formation.

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Re: BFTG - Bolton

by sandman » 20 Aug 2018 00:49

Ascotexgunner wrote:
Snowflake Royal wrote:
Ascotexgunner wrote:
Seriously? By then the team will be on its knees and pretty much on its way to league 1. We are worse than last year and even Clements signings are now looking ropey. 5 million for Baldock is looking a worse deal than Aluko. When your at the next game look around you at the stadium. Empty seats, empty boxes, advertising that's vanished, shirt sponsers that are no longer on the shirts. The problem is a lot deeper than the clueless manager we have in charge. Our CEO has worked for Chelsea and ManU....clubs that have money thrown at them, he's never ever run a club like ours where you have to work hard for it, and it shows. As for the owner......well.....that really could be nail in our coffin. He's making the Venkys look decent with his behaviour. And let's be honest here, Blackburn and Wigan had a plan b when they went down and have bounced back stronger. We don't have the brains in this club to even contemplate that eventuality, let alone prepare for it. I really really fear for this clubs future at the minute, financially and on the field.

As Kes would say, calm down to a panic mate.

We are not worse than last year. Baldock doesn't look anything like as bad a signing as Aluko and I certainly don't recall seeing £5m bandied about for him.


5 mil was the figure Tim Dellor quoted.


Ah, now I think I've spotted your mistake here.

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Re: BFTG - Bolton

by Denver Royal » 20 Aug 2018 03:39

sandman wrote:
Ascotexgunner wrote:
Snowflake Royal wrote:As Kes would say, calm down to a panic mate.

We are not worse than last year. Baldock doesn't look anything like as bad a signing as Aluko and I certainly don't recall seeing £5m bandied about for him.


5 mil was the figure Tim Dellor quoted.


Ah, now I think I've spotted your mistake here.

Is this like the 7 mil commonly cited for Aluko? I dunno, I'm trying to keep up, but I'm getting old :wink:

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Re: BFTG - Bolton

by WAZZOCK » 20 Aug 2018 06:26

Zip wrote:
WAZZOCK wrote:
Denver Royal wrote:
We wouldn't want to bounce straight back. It would be a 5 year plan, remember? :wink:

But seriously, re. League 1, doubt RG and BT have the nous for that, and they would not relish working there (nor would Clement, for that matter). So, if we drop, suspect it would all be 'chop and change', regardless.


If we get relegated to Lge 1 then RG would be out the door. It would be at this point that we see a much improved transfer policy under Tevereden, just like we saw in his first season in the role.



How do you know this? Pure speculation.


Educated guesswork.

Look at the recent past - in 16/17 BT was given license to get on with his job and we assembled a squad that almost got promoted.

Since then, a meddling CEO has micro managed this part of the club and has paid over the odds for a group of players who are completely unsuitable. Notice how BT doesn’t green tick every signing anymore?

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Re: BFTG - Bolton

by Theroyalbox » 20 Aug 2018 09:02

LightwaterRoyal wrote:
McShane - 6. Dealt with pretty much everything that came his way.

.


What? Seriously I think McShanes performance was one of the worst I've ever seen from a CB.

Every time he cleared a ball it went straight to the opposition. He got absolutely bullied by the Striker all game, and then he was caught for the goal. If he's not dropped for Illori then Clement only has himself to blame when hes sacked

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