The League of 4

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muirinho
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Re: The League of 4

by muirinho » 08 Apr 2019 18:11

Snowflake Royal
Hound we showed fighting spirit to get a draw at Sheff Weds, to win against Wigan, to beat a Preston side on a 6 game winning run. We got spanked by Leeds, then went away to Stoke and got a good draw

The Rotherham are fighters/we are bottlers thing is massively overdone for me. Just a cliche. Rotherham have been handy at home/shit away all season

True of us under Stam. Elements under Clement. Certainly not under Gomes.


Even then... Stam Season 2 only. Stam Season 1, we came back from some absolute tonkings to finish 3rd.

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Re: The League of 4

by Mid Sussex Royal » 08 Apr 2019 18:38

Sutekh To be honest I think it's Reading v Rotherham v Wigan with the loser joining Ipswich and Bolton is division 3.

Remaining games...

10 April

Hull v Wigan 0
Norwich v Reading 0
Rotherham v Villa 0

13 April

Reading Brentford 1
Stoke v Rotherham 1

14 April

Wigan v Norwich 0

19 April

Bristol City v Reading 0
Leeds v Wigan 0
Swansea v Rotherham 0

22 April

Reading v WBA 1
Rotherham v Birmingham 3
Wigan v Preston 1

27 April

Birmingham v Wigan 1
Middlesbrough v Reading 0
WBA v Rotherham 0

5 May

Reading v Birmingham 3
Rotherham v Middlesbrough 3
Wigan v Millwall 3

It's certainly going to be completely unpredictable - let's all hope Reading have a miracle result in them somewhere.


My points next to the remaining games above, I may be pessimistic but these results look reasonable, and would see us down but a win v Brentford would see Wigan down. Can easily see Rotherham winning their last 2 home games which would really put the pressure on.

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Re: The League of 4

by Zip » 08 Apr 2019 19:02

Brentford’s away form this season is dreadful. Won 2, D 8, L 10. We need to beat them on Saturday.

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Re: The League of 4

by URZZZZ » 09 Apr 2019 00:29

Hound I really wouldn't describe it as a horror run at all.

Its challenging, but other than playing QPR, what isn't? Brentford (won 2 away all season), Brum (lost last 3 away) at home - 2 mid table sides. WBA (lost 2 of last 3 away) will not have much to play for.

Away, Boro are abysmal (lost last 4 at home) and Brizzle very inconsistent (Last four home games: 1-2 vs Brum, 1-1 vs Ipswich, 0-1 vs Leeds, 2-2 vs Wigan). Couldn't ask to play two teams with worse current home form

It could be a hell of a lot worse. Only Norwich is a write off really


+1

Brentford's defence is garbage if you high press them and have a go at them. They're quite good going forward but as long as you hassle them and hit them hard, we should be fine. Do we have the ability/physicality to do that is another question though

Bristol struggle against lowly teams. Drew at home to Ipswich, drew at home to Wigan, drew at home to Millwall, only just scraped through 9 men Rotherham. Is that a case of complacency we could capitalise on or do they struggle to break teams down? Think the trouble is we don't seem to sit back which could hinder us

West Brom are the Reading 16-17 equivalent. They're really not very good, they play Robson Kanu, Gareth Barry and Chris Brunt. Nullify Gayle and his cheating and we'll be fine

Boro is hard to predict, their infamous five defenders and four centre midfielders formation may be difficult for us to break them down, and I think they'll be too strong at the other end from set pieces. Hard to say though, will depend on if they're in or out the playoffs or even still have a chance

Birmingham are a good team on the counter, think we'll struggle with that against the likes of Adams and Maghoma. Likely that they'll have nothing to play for so hopefully that works in our favour

Assuming we lose at Norwich, can see us getting 7 points from 15, which should be enough. But a defeat vs Brentford will really crank the pressure up

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Re: The League of 4

by Hound » 09 Apr 2019 07:15

See 5 out of the 6 SS ‘experts’ have us going down

Rotherham great spirit blah blah, whilst our poor home form (4 wins 2 draws from our last 7) will cost us apparently

Be a nice little motivator


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Re: The League of 4

by Stranded » 09 Apr 2019 08:34

Hound See 5 out of the 6 SS ‘experts’ have us going down

Rotherham great spirit blah blah, whilst our poor home form (4 wins 2 draws from our last 7) will cost us apparently

Be a nice little motivator


Whilst I've no problem with experts picking us to go down - they do speak some bollocks don't they.

Rotherham having "spirit" is just code for I know nothing about them but they are a small club trying to stay above their natural level so I'll make some condesending compliment about them - whilst our home form has been more than Ok this year (14 pts from 8) and better than Rotherham's home form by 3 pts over 8 games.

Over every measure, we should stay up but anything can happen - if we lose tomorrow and Rotherham manage to beat Villa, that may well change but I expect everything will be the same come 10pm Weds.

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Re: The League of 4

by Hound » 09 Apr 2019 08:46

Yes they do. Classic cliches and general rubbish

I’m still amazed Wigan are not being mentioned anywhere. They could very easily be bottom 3 on Saturday

Also amazed how we’ve gone from being ‘almost safe’ to favourites for relegation in one game where we were big favourites to lose against a good Hull side and Rotherham were likely to beat a soft Forest side

Brentford is a horribly massive game assuming we lose tomorrow. We really should win it but lose it and I’ll probably be siding with the experts

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Re: The League of 4

by Old Man Andrews » 09 Apr 2019 08:49

URZZZZ
Hound I really wouldn't describe it as a horror run at all.

Its challenging, but other than playing QPR, what isn't? Brentford (won 2 away all season), Brum (lost last 3 away) at home - 2 mid table sides. WBA (lost 2 of last 3 away) will not have much to play for.

Away, Boro are abysmal (lost last 4 at home) and Brizzle very inconsistent (Last four home games: 1-2 vs Brum, 1-1 vs Ipswich, 0-1 vs Leeds, 2-2 vs Wigan). Couldn't ask to play two teams with worse current home form

It could be a hell of a lot worse. Only Norwich is a write off really


+1

Brentford's defence is garbage if you high press them and have a go at them. They're quite good going forward but as long as you hassle them and hit them hard, we should be fine. Do we have the ability/physicality to do that is another question though

Bristol struggle against lowly teams. Drew at home to Ipswich, drew at home to Wigan, drew at home to Millwall, only just scraped through 9 men Rotherham. Is that a case of complacency we could capitalise on or do they struggle to break teams down? Think the trouble is we don't seem to sit back which could hinder us

West Brom are the Reading 16-17 equivalent. They're really not very good, they play Robson Kanu, Gareth Barry and Chris Brunt. Nullify Gayle and his cheating and we'll be fine

Boro is hard to predict, their infamous five defenders and four centre midfielders formation may be difficult for us to break them down, and I think they'll be too strong at the other end from set pieces. Hard to say though, will depend on if they're in or out the playoffs or even still have a chance

Birmingham are a good team on the counter, think we'll struggle with that against the likes of Adams and Maghoma. Likely that they'll have nothing to play for so hopefully that works in our favour

Assuming we lose at Norwich, can see us getting 7 points from 15, which should be enough. But a defeat vs Brentford will really crank the pressure up


Good summary tbf.

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Re: The League of 4

by URZZZZ » 09 Apr 2019 09:40

You know it’s bad when David prutton is the one fighting our corner, they’re all completely clueless anyway


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Re: The League of 4

by Stranded » 09 Apr 2019 09:50

Hound Yes they do. Classic cliches and general rubbish

I’m still amazed Wigan are not being mentioned anywhere. They could very easily be bottom 3 on Saturday

Also amazed how we’ve gone from being ‘almost safe’ to favourites for relegation in one game where we were big favourites to lose against a good Hull side and Rotherham were likely to beat a soft Forest side

Brentford is a horribly massive game assuming we lose tomorrow. We really should win it but lose it and I’ll probably be siding with the experts


With the safe to favourites bit it's almost as if they just looked at the weekends results and went, well Reading were the only team to lose so they must be doomed without looking at the slightly bigger picture.

Wigan are in the deep brown stuff - if the don't pick up any points from Hull (a), Norwich (H) & Leeds (a) then they will be in even bigger trouble as fully expect us and Rotherham to pick up something over the next 3.

Yep Brentford is and always was going to be massive, even if we had turned our HT lead at the weekend into points.

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Re: The League of 4

by Old Man Andrews » 09 Apr 2019 13:09

If we lose against Norwich and Brentford are we as good as down?

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Re: The League of 4

by Stranded » 09 Apr 2019 13:14

Old Man Andrews If we lose against Norwich and Brentford are we as good as down?


No.

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Re: The League of 4

by Old Man Andrews » 09 Apr 2019 13:16

Stranded
Old Man Andrews If we lose against Norwich and Brentford are we as good as down?


No.


Psychologically I think a home defeat to Brentford will kill us.


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Re: The League of 4

by Ascotexgunner » 09 Apr 2019 13:27

Old Man Andrews
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Old Man Andrews If we lose against Norwich and Brentford are we as good as down?


No.


Psychologically I think a home defeat to Brentford will kill us.


A big loss tomorrow and at home to Brentford is gonna put us in a very dark place.....
The nerves and the panic will set in.

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Re: The League of 4

by Victor Meldrew » 09 Apr 2019 13:45

URZZZZ
Hound I really wouldn't describe it as a horror run at all.

Its challenging, but other than playing QPR, what isn't? Brentford (won 2 away all season), Brum (lost last 3 away) at home - 2 mid table sides. WBA (lost 2 of last 3 away) will not have much to play for.

Away, Boro are abysmal (lost last 4 at home) and Brizzle very inconsistent (Last four home games: 1-2 vs Brum, 1-1 vs Ipswich, 0-1 vs Leeds, 2-2 vs Wigan). Couldn't ask to play two teams with worse current home form

It could be a hell of a lot worse. Only Norwich is a write off really


+1

Brentford's defence is garbage if you high press them and have a go at them. They're quite good going forward but as long as you hassle them and hit them hard, we should be fine. Do we have the ability/physicality to do that is another question though

Bristol struggle against lowly teams. Drew at home to Ipswich, drew at home to Wigan, drew at home to Millwall, only just scraped through 9 men Rotherham. Is that a case of complacency we could capitalise on or do they struggle to break teams down? Think the trouble is we don't seem to sit back which could hinder us

West Brom are the Reading 16-17 equivalent. They're really not very good, they play Robson Kanu, Gareth Barry and Chris Brunt. Nullify Gayle and his cheating and we'll be fine

Boro is hard to predict, their infamous five defenders and four centre midfielders formation may be difficult for us to break them down, and I think they'll be too strong at the other end from set pieces. Hard to say though, will depend on if they're in or out the playoffs or even still have a chance

Birmingham are a good team on the counter, think we'll struggle with that against the likes of Adams and Maghoma. Likely that they'll have nothing to play for so hopefully that works in our favour

Assuming we lose at Norwich, can see us getting 7 points from 15, which should be enough. But a defeat vs Brentford will really crank the pressure up


An interesting take on all the teams and matches involved.
Firstly on Brentford their goal difference is +7 to our -17 so if their defence is "garbage", what does it say about us and your summary that we just have to put them under pressure and we will be fine does require a very big leap of faith.
Aren't Hull similar and how did we do on Saturday?

As for the rest of the sides you conveniently forget that Birmingham beat Leeds on Saturday and that Bristol City went to Sheff Utd (possibly the hardest away fixture of all) and won the week before.
West brom don't start with the useless Robson-Kanu et al every week and don't forget they put 5 past us in the reverse fixture.
Middlesboro appear to have gone to pieces but are still in with a chance of top 6 and the play-offs.

So, we can talk about so-called experts writing us off-didn't they also say that Fulham would end up about mid-table and that Man Utd would challenge for the title?
I agree, even if some of you seem to have got het up about it, that we should take no notice of experts but there is no doubt we are one of the teams that could get relegated and not to do so requires much more commitment all over the pitch than we normally see.

The loan players have certainly improved us but the ultimate question is have they improved us enough and will they escape injury over the next month?

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Re: The League of 4

by Stranded » 09 Apr 2019 13:45

Ascotexgunner
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No.


Psychologically I think a home defeat to Brentford will kill us.


A big loss tomorrow and at home to Brentford is gonna put us in a very dark place.....
The nerves and the panic will set in.


Maybe it will but we can't take our results in isolation. What will a loss at home to Villa and at Stoke do to Rotherham, what would defeats to Hull and Norwich do to Wigan?

A home defeat to Brentford would not be helpful but the impact of it will fully depend on results elsewhere.

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Re: The League of 4

by URZZZZ » 09 Apr 2019 14:24

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URZZZZ
Hound I really wouldn't describe it as a horror run at all.

Its challenging, but other than playing QPR, what isn't? Brentford (won 2 away all season), Brum (lost last 3 away) at home - 2 mid table sides. WBA (lost 2 of last 3 away) will not have much to play for.

Away, Boro are abysmal (lost last 4 at home) and Brizzle very inconsistent (Last four home games: 1-2 vs Brum, 1-1 vs Ipswich, 0-1 vs Leeds, 2-2 vs Wigan). Couldn't ask to play two teams with worse current home form

It could be a hell of a lot worse. Only Norwich is a write off really


+1

Brentford's defence is garbage if you high press them and have a go at them. They're quite good going forward but as long as you hassle them and hit them hard, we should be fine. Do we have the ability/physicality to do that is another question though

Bristol struggle against lowly teams. Drew at home to Ipswich, drew at home to Wigan, drew at home to Millwall, only just scraped through 9 men Rotherham. Is that a case of complacency we could capitalise on or do they struggle to break teams down? Think the trouble is we don't seem to sit back which could hinder us

West Brom are the Reading 16-17 equivalent. They're really not very good, they play Robson Kanu, Gareth Barry and Chris Brunt. Nullify Gayle and his cheating and we'll be fine

Boro is hard to predict, their infamous five defenders and four centre midfielders formation may be difficult for us to break them down, and I think they'll be too strong at the other end from set pieces. Hard to say though, will depend on if they're in or out the playoffs or even still have a chance

Birmingham are a good team on the counter, think we'll struggle with that against the likes of Adams and Maghoma. Likely that they'll have nothing to play for so hopefully that works in our favour

Assuming we lose at Norwich, can see us getting 7 points from 15, which should be enough. But a defeat vs Brentford will really crank the pressure up


An interesting take on all the teams and matches involved.
Firstly on Brentford their goal difference is +7 to our -17 so if their defence is "garbage", what does it say about us and your summary that we just have to put them under pressure and we will be fine does require a very big leap of faith.
Aren't Hull similar and how did we do on Saturday?

As for the rest of the sides you conveniently forget that Birmingham beat Leeds on Saturday and that Bristol City went to Sheff Utd (possibly the hardest away fixture of all) and won the week before.
West brom don't start with the useless Robson-Kanu et al every week and don't forget they put 5 past us in the reverse fixture.
Middlesboro appear to have gone to pieces but are still in with a chance of top 6 and the play-offs.

So, we can talk about so-called experts writing us off-didn't they also say that Fulham would end up about mid-table and that Man Utd would challenge for the title?
I agree, even if some of you seem to have got het up about it, that we should take no notice of experts but there is no doubt we are one of the teams that could get relegated and not to do so requires much more commitment all over the pitch than we normally see.

The loan players have certainly improved us but the ultimate question is have they improved us enough and will they escape injury over the next month?


Obviously there's more to it than simply putting them under pressure but Brentford do really tend to struggle when you force them high up the pitch. Watch Derby's first goal against them at the weekend, they have 5 players high up, they dispossess them and go on and score. Hull are slightly different, they overload with wing play, whereas Brentford play more with inside forwards and play a lot more narrow. Also Hull haven't lost a home game in over 4 months, Brentford have only won 2 away the whole season

Again, your second point backs up what I mean. Birmingham play well on the counter, they beat Leeds twice, drew with United away, beat Bristol away etc. Yet when teams come to them and sit back, they'll struggle, like losing at home to Millwall, losing at home to Bolton, drawing at home to Ipswich. Same with Bristol

Point still stands with HRK. The fact he's even close to starting to a top 6 team is baffling. In the reverse fixture, Harvey Barnes ran us ragged, superb little player. He now plays for Leicester fortunately, and while Murphy is OK, he's no-where near the same level as Barnes

Still think Boro may make top 6 actually, they have a really favourable run in. Think their physicality will be too much for us, whilst our team isn't small, it isn't exactly tall either and Boro do get a lot of set pieces

I think we could deal without most of the loan players, if it's only 1 at a time. Jaakkola is good enough to stand in for Martinez, we'd just have to adjust the kicking, Ejaria can easily be swapped with a number of players, Bod and Baldock are back soon if Nelson gets another problem maybe if Baker or Miazga got injured we'd be in trouble

As long as we play Gunter each week, we'll be OK :wink:

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Re: The League of 4

by Victor Meldrew » 09 Apr 2019 14:36

URZZZZ
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URZZZZ
+1

Brentford's defence is garbage if you high press them and have a go at them. They're quite good going forward but as long as you hassle them and hit them hard, we should be fine. Do we have the ability/physicality to do that is another question though

Bristol struggle against lowly teams. Drew at home to Ipswich, drew at home to Wigan, drew at home to Millwall, only just scraped through 9 men Rotherham. Is that a case of complacency we could capitalise on or do they struggle to break teams down? Think the trouble is we don't seem to sit back which could hinder us

West Brom are the Reading 16-17 equivalent. They're really not very good, they play Robson Kanu, Gareth Barry and Chris Brunt. Nullify Gayle and his cheating and we'll be fine

Boro is hard to predict, their infamous five defenders and four centre midfielders formation may be difficult for us to break them down, and I think they'll be too strong at the other end from set pieces. Hard to say though, will depend on if they're in or out the playoffs or even still have a chance

Birmingham are a good team on the counter, think we'll struggle with that against the likes of Adams and Maghoma. Likely that they'll have nothing to play for so hopefully that works in our favour

Assuming we lose at Norwich, can see us getting 7 points from 15, which should be enough. But a defeat vs Brentford will really crank the pressure up


An interesting take on all the teams and matches involved.
Firstly on Brentford their goal difference is +7 to our -17 so if their defence is "garbage", what does it say about us and your summary that we just have to put them under pressure and we will be fine does require a very big leap of faith.
Aren't Hull similar and how did we do on Saturday?

As for the rest of the sides you conveniently forget that Birmingham beat Leeds on Saturday and that Bristol City went to Sheff Utd (possibly the hardest away fixture of all) and won the week before.
West brom don't start with the useless Robson-Kanu et al every week and don't forget they put 5 past us in the reverse fixture.
Middlesboro appear to have gone to pieces but are still in with a chance of top 6 and the play-offs.

So, we can talk about so-called experts writing us off-didn't they also say that Fulham would end up about mid-table and that Man Utd would challenge for the title?
I agree, even if some of you seem to have got het up about it, that we should take no notice of experts but there is no doubt we are one of the teams that could get relegated and not to do so requires much more commitment all over the pitch than we normally see.

The loan players have certainly improved us but the ultimate question is have they improved us enough and will they escape injury over the next month?


Obviously there's more to it than simply putting them under pressure but Brentford do really tend to struggle when you force them high up the pitch. Watch Derby's first goal against them at the weekend, they have 5 players high up, they dispossess them and go on and score. Hull are slightly different, they overload with wing play, whereas Brentford play more with inside forwards and play a lot more narrow. Also Hull haven't lost a home game in over 4 months, Brentford have only won 2 away the whole season

Again, your second point backs up what I mean. Birmingham play well on the counter, they beat Leeds twice, drew with United away, beat Bristol away etc. Yet when teams come to them and sit back, they'll struggle, like losing at home to Millwall, losing at home to Bolton, drawing at home to Ipswich. Same with Bristol

Point still stands with HRK. The fact he's even close to starting to a top 6 team is baffling. In the reverse fixture, Harvey Barnes ran us ragged, superb little player. He now plays for Leicester fortunately, and while Murphy is OK, he's no-where near the same level as Barnes

Still think Boro may make top 6 actually, they have a really favourable run in. Think their physicality will be too much for us, whilst our team isn't small, it isn't exactly tall either and Boro do get a lot of set pieces

I think we could deal without most of the loan players, if it's only 1 at a time. Jaakkola is good enough to stand in for Martinez, we'd just have to adjust the kicking, Ejaria can easily be swapped with a number of players, Bod and Baldock are back soon if Nelson gets another problem maybe if Baker or Miazga got injured we'd be in trouble

As long as we play Gunter each week, we'll be OK :wink:

:wink: :wink:

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Re: The League of 4

by Hound » 09 Apr 2019 15:21

I think we were just trying to provide some balance to the ‘nightmare run in’ comments

It’s by no means an easy run in - they are all good teams on poor runs at home or away. Not one is a gimme. But considering our form and their form, I think we should be confident

Of course Rotherham have a very similar run in, and it’s a case of making sure we match them all the way to the end.

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Re: The League of 4

by Stranded » 09 Apr 2019 16:12

Hound I think we were just trying to provide some balance to the ‘nightmare run in’ comments

It’s by no means an easy run in - they are all good teams on poor runs at home or away. Not one is a gimme. But considering our form and their form, I think we should be confident

Of course Rotherham have a very similar run in, and it’s a case of making sure we match them all the way to the end.


Yep - with the exception of Brentford - all our opponents form is below their league position (in some cases markedly - Bristol City 6th but 13th on form - Boro 8th but 24th on form), whereas half of Rotherham's are currently in better form - same for Wigan. So whilst it is tough, it is giving us a chance.

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