BFTG United (A)

[stealthpapes]

Finally, corners, can someone please tell me the point of short corners. I know our team isn't blessed with height but short corners always result in the opposition getting the ball off us

Completely agree, especially today.

If you're defending a lead, then perhaps yeah. Or against inferior teams who you think you might be able to outdo with clever passing and running.

None of the above has applied to Reading this season and certainly not in today's match against world class players so I was a bit confused. I'd have thought the best chance we had was to just chuck it into the mixer and hope. As far as I'm concerned unless you are playing a team of midgets against a team of giants corners are the great leveller as anything can happen.

Except they're not. Most of the time they sail over everyone or get cleared. In the absence of (a) excellent set piece takers, (b) well-drilled routines and (c) someone in the squad taller than Frodo and Samwise, there is literally no point putting it in the box 'to see what happens'.

Anyway, we weren't shit. I had fears on Friday watching Tranmere get dismantled. In places, we were alright, and 2-1 or 1-0 might have been a better reflection of the game I saw. We had three or four really good chances but also United had gears left to work through.

5 minutes added first half was a joke, much nearer to 3 would have been appropriate (VAR, when was that nonsense with Sanchez going down?)
5 quid bag drop, two separate bag searches, I may have a bit of a beard at the moment, but that was jokez.

Glad I went, somewhat hopeful the better points start turning up in the league but without a striker in form, well still struggle.

[Sutekh]

Swift, Kelly and, to a lesser degree, Bacuna are all supposedly dead ball specialists. None are anywhere near the quality of Caskey, Shorey or Harte though. Perhaps the current players should be targeted for some special training to improve on it.

[RoyalBlue]

What matters is which offence is committed first. As far as I can tell, the foul was committed before Fred touched the ball, so it is a penalty. A "pass" cannot be offside, only a player. It's not an offence to pass to someone in an offside position, it's an offence to interfere with play, interfere with an opponent, or gain an advantage having been in an offside position when a team mate was the last person to play the ball.

Sequence of events was like this:

1) Ball comes into Mata. Lukaku is in an offside position, but isn't interfering with play or an opponent so hasn't committed an offence.
2) Mata plays a pass to Fred, who is in an offside position.
3) Richards trips Mata. Foul.
4) Fred controls the ball and scores.

As Fred was offside, it is correct to disallow the goal. This means that there is no advantage following the foul, which happened before Fred interfered with play in an offside position. That means that it is a penalty.

Both decisions correct, and pretty much only possible due to VAR.

Cheers SCIAG. But now I think it should not have been given. Bear with me please....

I haven't rewatched it since your reply but I guess for me the confusion is whether or not Fred is fouling by being in an offside position and clearly looking to accept the ball (which he then did), and so clearly interfering in play. As you know, offside is given even before, or even without recipients touching the ball, which is why this is so confusing and interesting. So the *moment* Mata touches the ball that whole snapshot of a situation i.e. Mata has touched the ball with the intention for it to get to Fred, who is clearly interfering in play just by being where he is, in the offside triangle, and clearly with the intention of touching the ball, so that snapshot of a situation is a foul whether or not Fred touches the ball... in that moment a foul has occurred. It is THEN that Richards floors Mata.

So really, it should not have been given, arguably.

And this makes more sense because one could argue that RIchards, in that split second of a stressful scenario saw that Fred was in a dangerous position, saw that Mata was just about to pass to him, and - credit to the lad who after Swansea I argued shouldn't wear a Reading shirt again! - therefore having the presence of mind and foresight to see what was going on had little option but to risk a foul by doing everything he could to prevent that. Good man! Actually in my mind a brilliant move and I forgive the young lad for his Swansea lapses. So yeah Fred was clearly interfering in play by causing this confusion in the receiving position he was in. To put it more simply... I'm not sure subconsciously Richards would have gone in if Fred wasn't where he was. His offside foul positioning clearly interfered in play and lead to the foul tackle.

Interesting....

Why are you saying being offside is a foul ? That’s just nonsense !
Most of the rest of your analysis is just crazy.
The officialsgot it right and trying to rewrite the offside law whilst seemingly under the influence of mind altering substances isn’tgoing to change that.

Only other highly experienced and respected officials disagree that they got it right. OK, he's been retired some time now but Keith Hackett says the Assistant Reg got it right at the outset and Moss was wrong to interfere.

Upson spoke a lot of sense on MOTD when he stated that he felt Lukaku was interfering with play in that he moved to partially obstruct Richards making it difficult for him to get his tackle in and thus conceding the penalty. OK Upson is speaking as a defender and former Royal but nevertheless it does look a bit like that.

[Snowball]

Personally I was more entertained by the football we played under Clement where we scored goals. But we'll see how Gomes goes, he's doing roughly the same thing as Stam so far, but less badly and with higher tempo and greater purpose.

Nothing like Stam

We are getting possession stats in the opposition half.

Stay got 2/3 of his on the edge of the Reading box

[Snowball]

Finally, corners, can someone please tell me the point of short corners. I know our team isn't blessed with height but short corners always result in the opposition getting the ball off us

We've lacked a good corner taker for a while. Need someone who can whip the ball in with pace right into the 6 yard box. Make it harder for defenders to clear the ball.

The theory goes thus.

Scoring from a corner is very rare, except against Reading

.

corrected for you

[Snowflake Royal]

Personally I was more entertained by the football we played under Clement where we scored goals. But we'll see how Gomes goes, he's doing roughly the same thing as Stam so far, but less badly and with higher tempo and greater purpose.

Nothing like Stam

We are getting possession stats in the opposition half.

Stay got 2/3 of his on the edge of the Reading box

First season we spent a lot of time going nowhere camped around the opposition box. But I think I covered the difference with 'higher tempo and greater purpose'

[Victor Meldrew]

Watching on BT, a few points:-
I was glad that the commentator either knew Reading or had done his homework ,which is a change and it was not all about them.

Trust us to be one of the few playing at a ground where VAR was in place-in a competition that surely can't be right,although I suspect that non-league grounds , like Woking this afternoon , don't even have goal-line technology.

Today we found out what perhaps we already knew-nearly all of our players are good ON the ball but unfortunately in most league games you just don't get the time that they had yesterday.

I am a bit with Pistol Pete and a bit with leon on the question of strikers.
Ideally we play our way through and get goals but I can only think of one period when it worked for us at this level when Archie and Nogan played up front.(Habbin and Chappell were at a lower level when the opposition hadn't seen anything like it under Mansell)
At all other times there has been a target striker with ability in the air which for most teams is a necessity (Liverpool, Barcelona and City are not most teams).


Some posters are being a bit harsh IMHO on Ilori, Richards and Swift and a bit too kind (understandably as he is one of our own and young) towards Loader.

Based solely on his performances so far I think he has been fortunate to get so much game time ( I bet McNulty would love to have had as much) but clearly he is being played for his potential rather than because of where he is at now.
If we weren't in a relegation fight I would have no problem with this but we are and I think a greater physical presence up front or off the striker is essential.
What a shame he just didn't hit that one first-time rather than trying to be too careful.

It was good to see us moving the ball around so well BUT , as has often been the case this season, there was no end product and to stay up we will have to score goals, somehow.

Man Utd have real problems with their back-up defenders-we will face better back 4s in our league than turned out for them yesterday.

All in all the ideal (almost) game and result-the players and fans can hold their heads up high for a few days, can think that but for VAR the result MIGHT have been different and we can now concentrate on the league with the emphasis on "concentration" at the back, in midfield and when a goalscoring opportunity arises.

[Uke]

Watching on BT, a few points:-
I was glad that the commentator either knew Reading or had done his homework ,which is a change and it was not all about them.

Compare that with MOTD presenters constantly referring to “the Reading player” when discussing Omar Richards and the penalty, while naming every Manure player.

[Nameless]

Only other highly experienced and respected officials disagree that they got it right. OK, he's been retired some time now but Keith Hackett says the Assistant Reg got it right at the outset and Moss was wrong to interfere.

Upson spoke a lot of sense on MOTD when he stated that he felt Lukaku was interfering with play in that he moved to partially obstruct Richards making it difficult for him to get his tackle in and thus conceding the penalty. OK Upson is speaking as a defender and former Royal but nevertheless it does look a bit like that.

What is Hackett suggesting ?
Does he know who The AR was calling for offside ? If he was calling Fred then that makes sense and was indeed correct. The AR would not have been expected to have factored in the possible foul by Richards when flagging Fred. Not seen an angle that shows when the flag actually went up but I’d suspect the AR would have been pretty focused on Fred and it would have been an amazing achievement to have also watched Lukaku as the move developed.
Not convinced that Lukaku really interferes with Richards at any point, or even attempts to. He makes a very small move towards Mata but then actually pulls away and Richards doesn’t change his run at all.
It’s all very fine margins, could probably have gone the other way on a different day but I still think the correct decision was made and the case for it being wrong is pretty weak.

[Maneki Neko]

Gabby Logan.
Straight forward win for united. hmmm

BBC have been running with that line across their website, 5 Live and MOTD. So very different to BT’s view of the match, as well as most other media outlets.

Reading played well. Much better than expected or that our league position would suggest, but it was a straight forward win.

[Snowflake Royal]

Gabby Logan.
Straight forward win for united. hmmm

BBC have been running with that line across their website, 5 Live and MOTD. So very different to BT’s view of the match, as well as most other media outlets.

Reading played well. Much better than expected or that our league position would suggest, but it was a straight forward win.

Completely agree.

[Denver Royal]

Some posters are being a bit too kind (understandably as he is one of our own and young) towards Loader.Based solely on his performances so far I think he has been fortunate to get so much game time ( I bet McNulty would love to have had as much) but clearly he is being played for his potential rather than because of where he is at now. If we weren't in a relegation fight I would have no problem with this but we are and I think a greater physical presence up front or off the striker is essential.

Vic, you are risking your life in here criticizing the '18 year old lad' Loader. But, you're right. He is yet to score, and has rarely looked like doing so. We're in a relegation fight, and like with all players, he needs to be evaluated. Regardless of promise, is he providing what we need at this time, and could someone else do better? In our situation, I think that's basically what it comes down to for Gomes (or any manager). Btw, I like Loader, and his potential.

[Singing Defective]

Must say, watching the 21 year old Rinomhota make Rashford wish the latter had that extra gear some posters on here say Man Fu Ted weren’t using, by covering the inside of his run on goal, made sitting on a train for seven hours worthwhile. I understand AR has a soft spot for that lot in red pyjamas, so must have been a good day for him too. Shame we won’t be seeing AR in hoops for very long.

And lord was this a better performance than the “no, no, I insist, after you” effort of two years ago...

[AthleticoSpizz]

Great post, great log-on name SD

[Royal_jimmy]

Yesterday was a sensational performance. We never gave up even though we went 2-0 down which I thought was a harsh score line. I do think we over play slightly and we probably played the wrong striker. Nonetheless I feel confident we can stay up if we 1) get a better goal contribution from Swift, Aluko, Barrow and McCleary. 2) cut out the silly mistakes. Though to be fair Man Utd have the class to punish any side's errors. I doubt Forest would have scored from Swift giving the ball on the half way line and 3) maintaining the level of fight shown.

Our fans were really good as well. We need to really stay behind the players. I don't think we will get the space in midfield vs sides in the league and we will need to adapt to that.

Very proud and on another day we may have won that game. Really hope we take the game to Nottingham Forest and get an early goal rather than following this good showing with a shite show.

[Old Man Andrews]

Yesterday was a sensational performance. We never gave up even though we went 2-0 down which I thought was a harsh score line. I do think we over play slightly and we probably played the wrong striker. Nonetheless I feel confident we can stay up if we 1) get a better goal contribution from Swift, Aluko, Barrow and McCleary. 2) cut out the silly mistakes. Though to be fair Man Utd have the class to punish any side's errors. I doubt Forest would have scored from Swift giving the ball on the half way line and 3) maintaining the level of fight shown.

Our fans were really good as well. We need to really stay behind the players. I don't think we will get the space in midfield vs sides in the league and we will need to adapt to that.

Very proud and on another day we may have won that game. Really hope we take the game to Nottingham Forest and get an early goal rather than following this good showing with a shite show.

Wasn't sensational.

Take your tongue out of the players rear ends, they have done nothing for us all season.

[RoyalBlue]

BBC have been running with that line across their website, 5 Live and MOTD. So very different to BT’s view of the match, as well as most other media outlets.

Reading played well. Much better than expected or that our league position would suggest, but it was a straight forward win.

Completely agree.

Others, including OGS in his post match interviews, didn't agree.

[Snowball]

Man City 7-0 Rotherham (Seven lucky breakaways, Rotherham were robbed)
Man Utd 2-0 Reading (RFC are sh!t)

[Platypuss]

Yesterday was a sensational performance. We never gave up even though we went 2-0 down which I thought was a harsh score line. I do think we over play slightly and we probably played the wrong striker. Nonetheless I feel confident we can stay up if we 1) get a better goal contribution from Swift, Aluko, Barrow and McCleary. 2) cut out the silly mistakes. Though to be fair Man Utd have the class to punish any side's errors. I doubt Forest would have scored from Swift giving the ball on the half way line and 3) maintaining the level of fight shown.

Our fans were really good as well. We need to really stay behind the players. I don't think we will get the space in midfield vs sides in the league and we will need to adapt to that.

Very proud and on another day we may have won that game. Really hope we take the game to Nottingham Forest and get an early goal rather than following this good showing with a shite show.

Wasn't sensational.

Take your tongue out of the players rear ends, they have done nothing for us all season.

How dare you be positive and supportive RJ.

[Old Man Andrews]

Yesterday was a sensational performance. We never gave up even though we went 2-0 down which I thought was a harsh score line. I do think we over play slightly and we probably played the wrong striker. Nonetheless I feel confident we can stay up if we 1) get a better goal contribution from Swift, Aluko, Barrow and McCleary. 2) cut out the silly mistakes. Though to be fair Man Utd have the class to punish any side's errors. I doubt Forest would have scored from Swift giving the ball on the half way line and 3) maintaining the level of fight shown.

Our fans were really good as well. We need to really stay behind the players. I don't think we will get the space in midfield vs sides in the league and we will need to adapt to that.

Very proud and on another day we may have won that game. Really hope we take the game to Nottingham Forest and get an early goal rather than following this good showing with a shite show.

Wasn't sensational.

Take your tongue out of the players rear ends, they have done nothing for us all season.

How dare you be positive and supportive RJ.

It's a dishonest opinion. The players deserve absolutely nothing like the praise in the above post. It is a deeply immature reaction and typical of our supporters. They forget all the shit we have been served up this season because we just happened to not be embarrassed at Manchester United.