BFTG - Baggies

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Lower West
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Re: BFTG - Baggies

by Lower West » 13 Feb 2020 08:59

Ascotexgunner Unless we go on an amazing run soon I suspect we maybe looking for a new manager this summer.....
The owners surely cant ignore an empty stadium, sh*t football and looking over our shoulder in the league season after season as it now appears.


Changing managers isn't the solution though. That's that been achieved in the past few years is to build a squad full of players that no one else wants.

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Re: BFTG - Baggies

by leon » 13 Feb 2020 09:00

Ascotexgunner Unless we go on an amazing run soon I suspect we maybe looking for a new manager this summer.....
The owners surely cant ignore an empty stadium, sh*t football and looking over our shoulder in the league season after season as it now appears.


Shouldn’t have given him a new contract really. I’m not sure how we’ve dropped away so badly. Ejaria and Swift have been appalling and our midfield has been pretty much the root of the issue.

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Re: BFTG - Baggies

by Stranded » 13 Feb 2020 09:00

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Agreed, we have had an horrendous run of games, anybody with half a brain knew it would be difficult, just get the next two out of the way then we should be fine, if we did get dragged back into the mix down the bottom then the fans would have a right to moan, not the meltdown to losing to the best team in the league.


It has been very tough and makes the wins v Preston and Fulham at the start of this spell massive - we would be in trouble now without those wins.

We have to think of Saturday as a very winnable game though - Wednesday are in shocking form- they have played all of the bottom 3 in their last 4 games and only managed 1 point and they have only scored one goal at home since beating Bristol City 1-0 back on the 22nd December taking just 1 point in the process.

This is a game we should certainly have an expectation of getting at least a point from.


Weird team weds - off the top of my head before that horror run, they went to Leeds and beat them 2-0. They also smashed Forest away.

They've had some great results, and some absolute shockers. Depends what team turns up


They had a 6 game run up to Xmas where they won 4 and drew 2 beating Forest 4-0,Brentford & Bristol City in that run.

The loss at Stoke on Boxing Day where they let in 2 goals in injury time has completely destroyed them ( I guess similar to that 5 min spell against Fulham did for us a few seasons back) as including that game they have only won at Leeds in the last 9, losing 6.

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Re: BFTG - Baggies

by WestYorksRoyal » 13 Feb 2020 09:01

Ascotexgunner Unless we go on an amazing run soon I suspect we maybe looking for a new manager this summer.....
The owners surely cant ignore an empty stadium, sh*t football and looking over our shoulder in the league season after season as it now appears.

Then we'll be in exactly the same position in 12 months, or worse. If you look at where we were when Bowen joined, you can't argue with the improvement. The limitations of this squad are clear. Our striking options have either not settled in the Championship (Puscas) or are injured (Joao). We have no decent wide options. All this means we rely upon Swift, Ejaria and sometimes Adam running games. Stop them, stop us, as every opposition will know. No manager would be doing much better at the moment, especially when you consider recent fixtures. I'd actually say only Hull was a poor result.

If we get a new manager in the summer and complete another round of fantasy football signings, nothing will improve. Let Bowen tell the owners what he needs in the transfer market and get a proper go next season. It may not work out, but more of the same approach from recent seasons is guaranteed mediocrity.

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Re: BFTG - Baggies

by Hound » 13 Feb 2020 09:06

WestYorksRoyal
Ascotexgunner Unless we go on an amazing run soon I suspect we maybe looking for a new manager this summer.....
The owners surely cant ignore an empty stadium, sh*t football and looking over our shoulder in the league season after season as it now appears.

Then we'll be in exactly the same position in 12 months, or worse. If you look at where we were when Bowen joined, you can't argue with the improvement. The limitations of this squad are clear. Our striking options have either not settled in the Championship (Puscas) or are injured (Joao). We have no decent wide options. All this means we rely upon Swift, Ejaria and sometimes Adam running games. Stop them, stop us, as every opposition will know. No manager would be doing much better at the moment, especially when you consider recent fixtures. I'd actually say only Hull was a poor result.

If we get a new manager in the summer and complete another round of fantasy football signings, nothing will improve. Let Bowen tell the owners what he needs in the transfer market and get a proper go next season. It may not work out, but more of the same approach from recent seasons is guaranteed mediocrity.


yeah this very much. Get safe, get to the end of the season, get that FFP millstone of our backs, release the high earners McCleary, Gunter, Popa, Mannone, hopefully give Aluko away, possibly Baldock and Obita- and lets start fresh with a decent spine, a bit of money to spend and a manager who knows what we need (hopefully)

Last thing we want to do is bin Bowen, have a new bloke in who wants to spend a load of money then sidelines the likes of Joao and Puscas which leaves us back at square 1


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Re: BFTG - Baggies

by Stranded » 13 Feb 2020 09:09

leon
Ascotexgunner Unless we go on an amazing run soon I suspect we maybe looking for a new manager this summer.....
The owners surely cant ignore an empty stadium, sh*t football and looking over our shoulder in the league season after season as it now appears.


Shouldn’t have given him a new contract really. I’m not sure how we’ve dropped away so badly. Ejaria and Swift have been appalling and our midfield has been pretty much the root of the issue.


How does giving him 12 extra months cause any real difference. It'll cost us next to nothing to remove him in the summer if we decide to do so.

We are struggling to find a way to play at the moment because of the lopsided nature of the squad he inherited, we don't have a lot of like for like replacements for injured players so we are having to try and find a way forward - to a degree I can understand why we are being defensive at the moment but it puts massive pressure on us to score from the very few chances we do actually create. Doesn't help that our set pieces are awfully taken usually - though they improved once Obita took over yesterday.

We have been looking over our shoulder year after year for 5 of the last 6 seasons now and changed managers what 4 times in that spell - it is the years of staleness that are causing fans to stay away plus the fact all home midweek games can be watched at home or in the pub now as well - changing the manager again won't change that - Bowen is doing a decent job but we have just completed a run of games including fixtures against the sides currently in 1st, 3rd, 5th (twice),6th, 7th and 8th - in isolation none of the poor results we picked up were that unexpected really but coming in a run makes it feel worse.

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Re: BFTG - Baggies

by Old Man Andrews » 13 Feb 2020 09:16

Ascotexgunner Unless we go on an amazing run soon I suspect we maybe looking for a new manager this summer.....
The owners surely cant ignore an empty stadium, sh*t football and looking over our shoulder in the league season after season as it now appears.

They gave him a new contract about a month ago, he won't be going anywhere in the summer. A poor start to next season could do for him though.

I quite like Bowen personally, think he has a good approach to football. How much longer are we going to keep sacking managers and letting the players get away with it?

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Re: BFTG - Baggies

by NewCorkSeth » 13 Feb 2020 09:17

West Brom looked good. The played through us and, whether deliberate or not, completely stopped us playing it out with their high press. The lack of targets up top as well as the formation meant their fast closing down from the front left us incapable of retaining possession in the middle of the park.

Meite was barely used, Swift and Araruna were bullied off the ball and played far too high (why wasnt Swoft coming deep like he has been to great effect?), Ejaria was out of the game almost completely, and Puscas was isolated.

Hindsight is great and all that but we desperately needed to play either 2 up top or start with 2 deeper lying mids.

I thought Yiadom looked good, maybe should have closed down better for their first goal. Pele, yet again, was our best player. Gave the ball away once that I can remember but otherwise looked strong on and off the ball. In fact, given we started with Swift and Ejaria again, Pele looked the most accomplished passer in the team. Also the most likely to make something happen. Reckon Monaco will sell him to us?

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Re: BFTG - Baggies

by Hound » 13 Feb 2020 09:24

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Ascotexgunner Unless we go on an amazing run soon I suspect we maybe looking for a new manager this summer.....
The owners surely cant ignore an empty stadium, sh*t football and looking over our shoulder in the league season after season as it now appears.


Shouldn’t have given him a new contract really. I’m not sure how we’ve dropped away so badly. Ejaria and Swift have been appalling and our midfield has been pretty much the root of the issue.


How does giving him 12 extra months cause any real difference. It'll cost us next to nothing to remove him in the summer if we decide to do so.

We are struggling to find a way to play at the moment because of the lopsided nature of the squad he inherited, we don't have a lot of like for like replacements for injured players so we are having to try and find a way forward - to a degree I can understand why we are being defensive at the moment but it puts massive pressure on us to score from the very few chances we do actually create. Doesn't help that our set pieces are awfully taken usually - though they improved once Obita took over yesterday.

We have been looking over our shoulder year after year for 5 of the last 6 seasons now and changed managers what 4 times in that spell - it is the years of staleness that are causing fans to stay away plus the fact all home midweek games can be watched at home or in the pub now as well - changing the manager again won't change that - Bowen is doing a decent job but we have just completed a run of games including fixtures against the sides currently in 1st, 3rd, 5th (twice),6th, 7th and 8th - in isolation none of the poor results we picked up were that unexpected really but coming in a run makes it feel worse.


Agree on the contract. It makes naff all difference - just a basic stick to beat him with. Not like he signed for another 12 months and then put his feet up as he has his retirement fund sorted (unlike some players in the squad)

I feel Swift and Ejaria are a big part of the problem. Its no real criticism of them, but they were so key to our good form - as the who scored stats showed for example. Playing 40 odd games, twice a week, when you know the oppo are going to smash into you the second you get the ball, and are still required to fulfil your defensive duties (which they generally do), and create all your team's opportunities has taken its toll - probably mentally as much as physically.

Its very much true that if Swift plays well, we tend to play well, and he simply hasn't been in the last month.

Its why I feel it would be good to give them a break - Rino, Araruna, and Adam are decent replacements for a few games. Use Swift and Ejaria off the bench if necessary


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Re: BFTG - Baggies

by Ascotexgunner » 13 Feb 2020 09:25

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Ascotexgunner Unless we go on an amazing run soon I suspect we maybe looking for a new manager this summer.....
The owners surely cant ignore an empty stadium, sh*t football and looking over our shoulder in the league season after season as it now appears.


Shouldn’t have given him a new contract really. I’m not sure how we’ve dropped away so badly. Ejaria and Swift have been appalling and our midfield has been pretty much the root of the issue.


How does giving him 12 extra months cause any real difference. It'll cost us next to nothing to remove him in the summer if we decide to do so.

We are struggling to find a way to play at the moment because of the lopsided nature of the squad he inherited, we don't have a lot of like for like replacements for injured players so we are having to try and find a way forward - to a degree I can understand why we are being defensive at the moment but it puts massive pressure on us to score from the very few chances we do actually create. Doesn't help that our set pieces are awfully taken usually - though they improved once Obita took over yesterday.

We have been looking over our shoulder year after year for 5 of the last 6 seasons now and changed managers what 4 times in that spell - it is the years of staleness that are causing fans to stay away plus the fact all home midweek games can be watched at home or in the pub now as well - changing the manager again won't change that - Bowen is doing a decent job but we have just completed a run of games including fixtures against the sides currently in 1st, 3rd, 5th (twice),6th, 7th and 8th - in isolation none of the poor results we picked up were that unexpected really but coming in a run makes it feel worse.


Its not about what "we" the fans think though is it. As we have seen at other clubs, many owners don't think like fans. Bowen has certainly proved himself to a point.....but......its what the owner thinks. Its his money he is pouring into the club. If this run were to continue, put yourself in his shoes...what would you do? Sell up, pour more money in and gamble everything will work out with the current manager and give him money, or maybe get someone else in with different ideas, maybe even a track record of success (just for a change). Its what the owner does, and lets be honest none of us know how they think, but from their point of view and looking at an empty stadium week after week must be disheartening.

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Re: BFTG - Baggies

by leon » 13 Feb 2020 09:27

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Ascotexgunner Unless we go on an amazing run soon I suspect we maybe looking for a new manager this summer.....
The owners surely cant ignore an empty stadium, sh*t football and looking over our shoulder in the league season after season as it now appears.


Shouldn’t have given him a new contract really. I’m not sure how we’ve dropped away so badly. Ejaria and Swift have been appalling and our midfield has been pretty much the root of the issue.


How does giving him 12 extra months cause any real difference. It'll cost us next to nothing to remove him in the summer if we decide to do so.

We are struggling to find a way to play at the moment because of the lopsided nature of the squad he inherited, we don't have a lot of like for like replacements for injured players so we are having to try and find a way forward - to a degree I can understand why we are being defensive at the moment but it puts massive pressure on us to score from the very few chances we do actually create. Doesn't help that our set pieces are awfully taken usually - though they improved once Obita took over yesterday.

We have been looking over our shoulder year after year for 5 of the last 6 seasons now and changed managers what 4 times in that spell - it is the years of staleness that are causing fans to stay away plus the fact all home midweek games can be watched at home or in the pub now as well - changing the manager again won't change that - Bowen is doing a decent job but we have just completed a run of games including fixtures against the sides currently in 1st, 3rd, 5th (twice),6th, 7th and 8th - in isolation none of the poor results we picked up were that unexpected really but coming in a run makes it feel worse.


My point is we didn’t need to do anything.

Bowen has made a difference however we are slipping back into bad old habits - the lack of midfield movement is shocking contributing to the defensive overplaying.

This squad needs trimming down and some actual pace added. Agreed the summer is going to be important.

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Re: BFTG - Baggies

by Stranded » 13 Feb 2020 09:32

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Shouldn’t have given him a new contract really. I’m not sure how we’ve dropped away so badly. Ejaria and Swift have been appalling and our midfield has been pretty much the root of the issue.


How does giving him 12 extra months cause any real difference. It'll cost us next to nothing to remove him in the summer if we decide to do so.

We are struggling to find a way to play at the moment because of the lopsided nature of the squad he inherited, we don't have a lot of like for like replacements for injured players so we are having to try and find a way forward - to a degree I can understand why we are being defensive at the moment but it puts massive pressure on us to score from the very few chances we do actually create. Doesn't help that our set pieces are awfully taken usually - though they improved once Obita took over yesterday.

We have been looking over our shoulder year after year for 5 of the last 6 seasons now and changed managers what 4 times in that spell - it is the years of staleness that are causing fans to stay away plus the fact all home midweek games can be watched at home or in the pub now as well - changing the manager again won't change that - Bowen is doing a decent job but we have just completed a run of games including fixtures against the sides currently in 1st, 3rd, 5th (twice),6th, 7th and 8th - in isolation none of the poor results we picked up were that unexpected really but coming in a run makes it feel worse.


Its not about what "we" the fans think though is it. As we have seen at other clubs, many owners don't think like fans. Bowen has certainly proved himself to a point.....but......its what the owner thinks. Its his money he is pouring into the club. If this run were to continue, put yourself in his shoes...what would you do? Sell up, pour more money in and gamble everything will work out with the current manager and give him money, or maybe get someone else in with different ideas, maybe even a track record of success (just for a change). Its what the owner does, and lets be honest none of us know how they think, but from their point of view and looking at an empty stadium week after week must be disheartening.


Maybe but the only way to get the fans in is to win - we were essentially winning and boring in Stam's first year, so the style means naff all, winning does. Our home form has been shocking for years now, think I posted recently that we have around a 31% win rate at home.

We have changed managers, made wholesale changes to the squad in that time and are still shocking at home. It is nothing to do with the current incumbanent and chances are we change again the same will happen. Also the more you hire and fire, the less attractive you become as a place to work, so you are left looking at either managers who can't get a job or left wing shouts like Gomes. This constant shifting of players/staff will also likely be affecting attendances too.

I will be amazed if we change managers again this summer unless we really really struggle over the last 14 games - which given the opposition we have in the majority of those I would hope will not be the case.

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Re: BFTG - Baggies

by Sanguine » 13 Feb 2020 09:35

So what has happened to Ejaria and Swift? Last game I saw was at Fulham and they were both terrific, and we created plenty of chances.


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Re: BFTG - Baggies

by Stranded » 13 Feb 2020 09:35

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Shouldn’t have given him a new contract really. I’m not sure how we’ve dropped away so badly. Ejaria and Swift have been appalling and our midfield has been pretty much the root of the issue.


How does giving him 12 extra months cause any real difference. It'll cost us next to nothing to remove him in the summer if we decide to do so.

We are struggling to find a way to play at the moment because of the lopsided nature of the squad he inherited, we don't have a lot of like for like replacements for injured players so we are having to try and find a way forward - to a degree I can understand why we are being defensive at the moment but it puts massive pressure on us to score from the very few chances we do actually create. Doesn't help that our set pieces are awfully taken usually - though they improved once Obita took over yesterday.

We have been looking over our shoulder year after year for 5 of the last 6 seasons now and changed managers what 4 times in that spell - it is the years of staleness that are causing fans to stay away plus the fact all home midweek games can be watched at home or in the pub now as well - changing the manager again won't change that - Bowen is doing a decent job but we have just completed a run of games including fixtures against the sides currently in 1st, 3rd, 5th (twice),6th, 7th and 8th - in isolation none of the poor results we picked up were that unexpected really but coming in a run makes it feel worse.


My point is we didn’t need to do anything.

Bowen has made a difference however we are slipping back into bad old habits - the lack of midfield movement is shocking contributing to the defensive overplaying.

This squad needs trimming down and some actual pace added. Agreed the summer is going to be important.


Yep we didn't need to do anything but my point is the extra year doesn't really change anything except we have a manager in place who, barring a terrible run in, will likely be able to plan for next season.

If Bowen didn't have the contract, we would enter the summer either trying to negotiate the extension or trying to find another manager when we need to be focusing on the squad - esp. as this summer we can free up a shed load of wages and have more FFP wiggle room - wasting a month or two not knowing who the manager is would hamper us.

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Re: BFTG - Baggies

by Old Man Andrews » 13 Feb 2020 09:36

Sanguine So what has happened to Ejaria and Swift? Last game I saw was at Fulham and they were both terrific, and we created plenty of chances.

Tired, been found out by the opposition.

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Re: BFTG - Baggies

by Sanguine » 13 Feb 2020 09:37

Old Man Andrews
Sanguine So what has happened to Ejaria and Swift? Last game I saw was at Fulham and they were both terrific, and we created plenty of chances.

Tired, been found out by the opposition.


What has been found out? Or rather what are the opposition doing now that Fulham didn't?

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Re: BFTG - Baggies

by NewCorkSeth » 13 Feb 2020 09:38

Sanguine So what has happened to Ejaria and Swift? Last game I saw was at Fulham and they were both terrific, and we created plenty of chances.

Joao enabled them to play better for a bit and they were simply in form. It happens. They needed a break and yesterday was the best opportunity.

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Re: BFTG - Baggies

by Norfolk Royal » 13 Feb 2020 09:39

Frustrating game to watch. We've got players with a lot of talent but there are several missing links holding us back. The Joao injury is the obvious as he was holding the ball up and bringing others into the game and on good form when he got injured.

Meite is not that sort of player and is most effective when he turns and runs with the ball. Agree with other posters that Puscas will score goals when paired with a big mobile striker, look at the Wigan away game for instance.

Credit to WBA for closing us down, very effective championship team following the template albeit. Should have won more comfortably in scoreline terms.

However, thought the biggest miss was a quick wide player last night. We had no outlet and only serves to highlight the poor decision in my view to offload Barrow. I know he has his detractors but anything from him would have been welcome last night.

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Re: BFTG - Baggies

by Ascotexgunner » 13 Feb 2020 09:40

Old Man Andrews
Sanguine So what has happened to Ejaria and Swift? Last game I saw was at Fulham and they were both terrific, and we created plenty of chances.

Tired, been found out by the opposition.


Ejaria's hips wiggling and dropping of the shoulder doesn't seem to work anymore.

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Re: BFTG - Baggies

by leon » 13 Feb 2020 09:40

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How does giving him 12 extra months cause any real difference. It'll cost us next to nothing to remove him in the summer if we decide to do so.

We are struggling to find a way to play at the moment because of the lopsided nature of the squad he inherited, we don't have a lot of like for like replacements for injured players so we are having to try and find a way forward - to a degree I can understand why we are being defensive at the moment but it puts massive pressure on us to score from the very few chances we do actually create. Doesn't help that our set pieces are awfully taken usually - though they improved once Obita took over yesterday.

We have been looking over our shoulder year after year for 5 of the last 6 seasons now and changed managers what 4 times in that spell - it is the years of staleness that are causing fans to stay away plus the fact all home midweek games can be watched at home or in the pub now as well - changing the manager again won't change that - Bowen is doing a decent job but we have just completed a run of games including fixtures against the sides currently in 1st, 3rd, 5th (twice),6th, 7th and 8th - in isolation none of the poor results we picked up were that unexpected really but coming in a run makes it feel worse.


Its not about what "we" the fans think though is it. As we have seen at other clubs, many owners don't think like fans. Bowen has certainly proved himself to a point.....but......its what the owner thinks. Its his money he is pouring into the club. If this run were to continue, put yourself in his shoes...what would you do? Sell up, pour more money in and gamble everything will work out with the current manager and give him money, or maybe get someone else in with different ideas, maybe even a track record of success (just for a change). Its what the owner does, and lets be honest none of us know how they think, but from their point of view and looking at an empty stadium week after week must be disheartening.


Maybe but the only way to get the fans in is to win - we were essentially winning and boring in Stam's first year, so the style means naff all, winning does. Our home form has been shocking for years now, think I posted recently that we have around a 31% win rate at home.

We have changed managers, made wholesale changes to the squad in that time and are still shocking at home. It is nothing to do with the current incumbanent and chances are we change again the same will happen. Also the more you hire and fire, the less attractive you become as a place to work, so you are left looking at either managers who can't get a job or left wing shouts like Gomes. This constant shifting of players/staff will also likely be affecting attendances too.

I will be amazed if we change managers again this summer unless we really really struggle over the last 14 games - which given the opposition we have in the majority of those I would hope will not be the case.


I would argue that the crowds have declined as the entertainment has declined and I’d trace that back to us adopting possession heavy football - as per the fashion at the time.

Adkins tried it at first as have subsequent managers - all failed at it, and as a result we’ve been shit to watch Season after season- hence the crowds.

Bowen I think understands this and trying to change it. Well I hope he is.

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