Generic clubs in financial crisis Thread

[WestYorksRoyal]

Well, this is interesting. Football league clubs have voted to implement a total salary cap of £2.5m for League One and £1.5m for League Two for the 2020-21 season - agreement also to restrict squad size to no more than 20 players over 21 years of age. Proposal in front of Championship clubs is apparently for a cap of £20m, but this hasn't been voted on yet.

So in L1 that's £125k p.a. per senior player, and £75k p.a. in L2. Seems fair reflection of ability; top 5% or so of earners in the country but not enough to retire on at 35. Do we know if U21s are outside the cap? Would seem logical.

Very on board with the Championship getting one too. What would happen with players coming down from the PL? Would they need to put clauses in their contracts?

[Stranded]

Well, this is interesting. Football league clubs have voted to implement a total salary cap of £2.5m for League One and £1.5m for League Two for the 2020-21 season - agreement also to restrict squad size to no more than 20 players over 21 years of age. Proposal in front of Championship clubs is apparently for a cap of £20m, but this hasn't been voted on yet.

So in L1 that's £125k p.a. per senior player, and £75k p.a. in L2. Seems fair reflection of ability; top 5% or so of earners in the country but not enough to retire on at 35. Do we know if U21s are outside the cap? Would seem logical.

Very on board with the Championship getting one too. What would happen with players coming down from the PL? Would they need to put clauses in their contracts?

U21s do not count to the cap or the squad size - could lead to an interesting situation whereby some very young players get larger deals to take them through to 21, if they are seen as worth it - then hopefully sold on before their wages hit the cap.

[WestYorksRoyal]

Also puts real pressure to prove yourself before 21. You need to show you're worth a place in the 20 man squad. Not sure how I feel about that; some players develop later. How old was Rinomhota in his breakthrough season? 22?

[Wycombe Royal]

THere is also going to be quite a few footballers who now find themselves without a club and not many clubs looking for players.....for example it will be interesting to see what happens to Osho now....he's 22 in a week....will he get a Championship club or is he scrabbling around for L1???

[Sanguine]

Well, this is interesting. Football league clubs have voted to implement a total salary cap of £2.5m for League One and £1.5m for League Two for the 2020-21 season - agreement also to restrict squad size to no more than 20 players over 21 years of age. Proposal in front of Championship clubs is apparently for a cap of £20m, but this hasn't been voted on yet.

That is a massive gap between the Champ and L1. But seriously £48k per week cap in League 1? THat is seriously low. Clubs like Sunderland, Portsmouth, Charlton and Ipswich can sustain wages far higher than that. Should be based around turnover in my opinion.

So how do relegated clubs from Champ conform to the cap? You get relegated with a "20m wage bill and most of your players remain under contract for another 2 years....have they given guidelines on how they are supposed to fix that?

Assume there are details to still be ironed out, probably a transition down to the cap over a couple of seasons. Clubs are to be given until 21-22 to bring their squad size down too.

I'm not sure about £2.5m being too low. £48k a week is roughly 24 players earning £100k a year for League One football. That's about right isn't it?

[Snowflake Royal]

It's the leap to Championship level that makes it look low. But the Championship has a lot more televised stuff and therefore bigger tv income so it probably makes sense.

Be interesting to see whether there's any way to enforce clubs putting in place relegation release or wage reduction clauses in contracts and what the penalties would be for failing to abide by the rules. Especially as the PL is outside the FL jurisdiction. We've seen clubs get relegated from the Prem several times without reduction clauses in place for everyone because they didn't think they could go down at the time they were signed.

Perhaps a new phase for enforced firesales on relegation. I'm all for anything that gives the FL more teeth to make clubs behave responsibly.

[Hendo]

Well, this is interesting. Football league clubs have voted to implement a total salary cap of £2.5m for League One and £1.5m for League Two for the 2020-21 season - agreement also to restrict squad size to no more than 20 players over 21 years of age. Proposal in front of Championship clubs is apparently for a cap of £20m, but this hasn't been voted on yet.

That is a massive gap between the Champ and L1. But seriously £48k per week cap in League 1? THat is seriously low. Clubs like Sunderland, Portsmouth, Charlton and Ipswich can sustain wages far higher than that. Should be based around turnover in my opinion.

So how do relegated clubs from Champ conform to the cap? You get relegated with a "20m wage bill and most of your players remain under contract for another 2 years....have they given guidelines on how they are supposed to fix that?

Assume there are details to still be ironed out, probably a transition down to the cap over a couple of seasons. Clubs are to be given until 21-22 to bring their squad size down too.

I'm not sure about £2.5m being too low. £48k a week is roughly 24 players earning £100k a year for League One football. That's about right isn't it?

You’d also think that the bigger clubs will be able to offer decent sized signing on bonuses which would be outside the wage cap, like it is in NFL for example.

[WestYorksRoyal]

That is a massive gap between the Champ and L1. But seriously £48k per week cap in League 1? THat is seriously low. Clubs like Sunderland, Portsmouth, Charlton and Ipswich can sustain wages far higher than that. Should be based around turnover in my opinion.

So how do relegated clubs from Champ conform to the cap? You get relegated with a "20m wage bill and most of your players remain under contract for another 2 years....have they given guidelines on how they are supposed to fix that?

Assume there are details to still be ironed out, probably a transition down to the cap over a couple of seasons. Clubs are to be given until 21-22 to bring their squad size down too.

I'm not sure about £2.5m being too low. £48k a week is roughly 24 players earning £100k a year for League One football. That's about right isn't it?

You’d also think that the bigger clubs will be able to offer decent sized signing on bonuses which would be outside the wage cap, like it is in NFL for example.

Which is fine really. A large signing on bonus is a one off payment you offer if you can afford; it's not like being locked in to long term wage obligations. So long as they don't find creative ways like being paid directly by sponsors or something like that; those are the loopholes to monitor

[Stranded]

Would essentially negate the cap though if signing on fee is not monitored or controlled. Fine if say Sunderland offer a bigger one in line with their income but can easily see a smaller club "taking a chance" still and forking out a few million in up front fees to try to attract the better players.

[Sutekh]

How about introducing a rule that completely bans any form of signing on fee?

[BR0B0T]

Hasn't all this caused problems for Salford City?

[Nameless]

Surely signing on fees are included in the cap ? It includes basic wages, bonuses, image rights and all other fees paid to players.
The interesting one will be whether the Saracens dodge is included. Is it possible for a player to be paid for a second job (even if no work is done) through another company ? So we could employ all our players as advisors to Royal Elm Park at £10k a week, would that fall outside the cap ?

[From Despair To Where?]

Hasn't all this caused problems for Salford City?

They're like a mini Bournemouth the "fairy tale" belies the fact they've got where they are by spending way beyond their means and spending significantly more than their peers.

I actually saw them a couple of time in the 90's because a Uni mate played for them and I lived in Broughton, about half a milefrom their ground. That was in the North West Counties League and they get crowds of about 50. My house in Broughton actually overlooked The Cliff. We actually trained there a couple of times as McGhee used to call I'm a favour from Fergie if we had away games in the North West.

[Nameless]

Hasn't all this caused problems for Salford City?

They're like a mini Bournemouth the "fairy tale" belies the fact they've got where they are by spending way beyond their means and spending significantly more than their peers.

I actually saw them a couple of time in the 90's because a Uni mate played for them and I lived in Broughton, about half a milefrom their ground. That was in the North West Counties League and they get crowds of about 50. My house in Broughton actually overlooked The Cliff. We actually trained there a couple of times as McGhee used to call I'm a favour from Fergie if we had away games in the North West.

Surely every one knows Salford are owned and funded by some very wealthy people, there have been documentaries about it, it’s hardly a secret.
Do they spend beyond their means ? They might spend more than they earn through gate receipts but that’s not the same thing at all.
And spending more than other clubs is hardly new or wrong. The Football League only existed because some clubs wanted to spend more than others 150 years ago !

[Stranded]

Hasn't all this caused problems for Salford City?

They're like a mini Bournemouth the "fairy tale" belies the fact they've got where they are by spending way beyond their means and spending significantly more than their peers.

I actually saw them a couple of time in the 90's because a Uni mate played for them and I lived in Broughton, about half a milefrom their ground. That was in the North West Counties League and they get crowds of about 50. My house in Broughton actually overlooked The Cliff. We actually trained there a couple of times as McGhee used to call I'm a favour from Fergie if we had away games in the North West.

Surely every one knows Salford are owned and funded by some very wealthy people, there have been documentaries about it, it’s hardly a secret.
Do they spend beyond their means ? They might spend more than they earn through gate receipts but that’s not the same thing at all.
And spending more than other clubs is hardly new or wrong. The Football League only existed because some clubs wanted to spend more than others 150 years ago !

I guess there is a point where it almost becomes financial doping - didn't they offer Adam Rooney something silly like 4k a a week in the National League (given the average wage for a pro at that level is around 50k max - that is a massive jump) - so he moved from the SPL to English non-league even though clubs higher up the pyramid wanted him but understandably couldn't match that kind of weekly wage.

History is full of clubs who spent more than others but did it badly so didn't see any benefit at all, in fact ended up in a worst position but some fees/wages are so out of kilter with the rest of a league that you can see why it puts noses out of joint.

[Sanguine]

You’d also think that the bigger clubs will be able to offer decent sized signing on bonuses which would be outside the wage cap, like it is in NFL for example.

Detail I read said that cap would include signing on fees, all contract bonuses (goals etc) and agents' fees.

[Hendo]

You’d also think that the bigger clubs will be able to offer decent sized signing on bonuses which would be outside the wage cap, like it is in NFL for example.

Detail I read said that cap would include signing on fees, all contract bonuses (goals etc) and agents' fees.

Wow, that is going to be interesting then.

[Nameless]

You’d also think that the bigger clubs will be able to offer decent sized signing on bonuses which would be outside the wage cap, like it is in NFL for example.

Detail I read said that cap would include signing on fees, all contract bonuses (goals etc) and agents' fees.

Wow, that is going to be interesting then.

How could it be any different ?
If you excluded one form of payment you invalidate the cap.
Teams would simply pay a £2 million signing on fee paid in monthly instalments across the duration of the contract.
I actually think compared to rugby the rules look quite lax. Rugby have to include payments made to family members as well. Will be 8nteresting to see full details. How does it cater for long term injury ? If you are at the cap and get several long term injuries can you remove the players from the squad and bring in loans to replace them or are you stuck with a smaller squad ?
What about the examplesquoted elsewhere where a club funds part of a player’s wages at another club ? Who’s cap does that count towards ?

[From Despair To Where?]

They're like a mini Bournemouth the "fairy tale" belies the fact they've got where they are by spending way beyond their means and spending significantly more than their peers.

I actually saw them a couple of time in the 90's because a Uni mate played for them and I lived in Broughton, about half a milefrom their ground. That was in the North West Counties League and they get crowds of about 50. My house in Broughton actually overlooked The Cliff. We actually trained there a couple of times as McGhee used to call I'm a favour from Fergie if we had away games in the North West.

Surely every one knows Salford are owned and funded by some very wealthy people, there have been documentaries about it, it’s hardly a secret.
Do they spend beyond their means ? They might spend more than they earn through gate receipts but that’s not the same thing at all.
And spending more than other clubs is hardly new or wrong. The Football League only existed because some clubs wanted to spend more than others 150 years ago !

I guess there is a point where it almost becomes financial doping - didn't they offer Adam Rooney something silly like 4k a a week in the National League (given the average wage for a pro at that level is around 50k max - that is a massive jump) - so he moved from the SPL to English non-league even though clubs higher up the pyramid wanted him but understandably couldn't match that kind of weekly wage.

History is full of clubs who spent more than others but did it badly so didn't see any benefit at all, in fact ended up in a worst position but some fees/wages are so out of kilter with the rest of a league that you can see why it puts noses out of joint.

The focus seems to be completely on the Class of 92 but to all intents and purposes, they are a front for the people with the real financial clout. If FFP was extended throughout the whole football league, they would have absolutely no chance of complying.

I guess that opens up a different issue about the effectiveness of FFP. It certainly rules out the prospect of another Wigan or Bournemouth as it seems to pull up the ladder between established Championship sides and clubs who aspire to get there. It's a far from perfect fix for a complex problem.

As a whole, I'm not against the bankrolling of clubs by wealthy individuals but obviously the issue lies with whether it's responsible and benevolent ownership but I'd love to meet the person who finds a fix for that.

[Sutekh]

Detail I read said that cap would include signing on fees, all contract bonuses (goals etc) and agents' fees.

Wow, that is going to be interesting then.

How could it be any different ?
If you excluded one form of payment you invalidate the cap.
Teams would simply pay a £2 million signing on fee paid in monthly instalments across the duration of the contract.
I actually think compared to rugby the rules look quite lax. Rugby have to include payments made to family members as well. Will be 8nteresting to see full details. How does it cater for long term injury ? If you are at the cap and get several long term injuries can you remove the players from the squad and bring in loans to replace them or are you stuck with a smaller squad ?
What about the examplesquoted elsewhere where a club funds part of a player’s wages at another club ? Who’s cap does that count towards ?

Hello Mr Smith, we would like you to sign for this club. Under the terms of the salary cap we can only offer you 10k per week. By the way how is your wife at using Outlook....