by 6ft Kerplunk » 03 Feb 2020 11:02
6ft Kerplunk Is there a valid reason why VAR isn't used for spotting keepers moving off their line at penalties?
Old Man Andrews6ft Kerplunk Is there a valid reason why VAR isn't used for spotting keepers moving off their line at penalties?
Possibly so that they aren't deemed too picky. Every keeper in the history of time has come off his line a bit before a penalty is taken, you have to in order to dive. I think they are allowing the assistant referee to use their judgement as to if that movement is excessive or given the goalkeeper a huge advantage.
by 6ft Kerplunk » 03 Feb 2020 16:18
by Snowflake Royal » 03 Feb 2020 19:59
Sanguine Yep. I've been a big supporter of VAR, but it is becoming a caricature of itself now. Arguably two pens missed in the Liverpool game (Shane Long had his arms round Firmino's neck, and Fabinho's trip on Ings, after which Liverpool scored their first), and Sterling should have been sent off long before the 2-3 minutes it took to award City a penalty.
by Snowflake Royal » 03 Feb 2020 20:02
6ft Kerplunk So why have the rule at all if you're not going to enforce it? They seem quite happy deal in mm for offside that's more difficult to judge.
by Royal Rother » 04 Feb 2020 06:50
Snowflake Royal6ft Kerplunk So why have the rule at all if you're not going to enforce it? They seem quite happy deal in mm for offside that's more difficult to judge.
They enforce it on blatant offences. It's to encourage keepers not to take a huge step out and narrow the angle unfairly. A few milimeters in a microsecond has no real effect,
by Snowflake Royal » 04 Feb 2020 07:19
Royal RotherSnowflake Royal6ft Kerplunk So why have the rule at all if you're not going to enforce it? They seem quite happy deal in mm for offside that's more difficult to judge.
They enforce it on blatant offences. It's to encourage keepers not to take a huge step out and narrow the angle unfairly. A few milimeters in a microsecond has no real effect,
Well yes, but the same comment applies to the fractional VAR offsides
by Franchise FC » 04 Feb 2020 08:33
Snowflake RoyalRoyal RotherSnowflake Royal They enforce it on blatant offences. It's to encourage keepers not to take a huge step out and narrow the angle unfairly. A few milimeters in a microsecond has no real effect,
Well yes, but the same comment applies to the fractional VAR offsides
Couple of points there... firstly I don't agree with a milimeter based approach in offside anyway.
Secondly, the scenario is somewhat different in that play carries on pending the check and then results in a free kick and moves on.
Pens, it results in a retake and you can end up in an endless loop of retaking a penalty. Also, there's no change to how either side plays with offside. With pens, you'd force keepers to stay still longer to be sure of not being pulled up and therefore harming their chance of making a save.
by Royal Rother » 04 Feb 2020 09:40
Snowflake RoyalRoyal RotherSnowflake Royal They enforce it on blatant offences. It's to encourage keepers not to take a huge step out and narrow the angle unfairly. A few milimeters in a microsecond has no real effect,
Well yes, but the same comment applies to the fractional VAR offsides
Couple of points there... firstly I don't agree with a milimeter based approach in offside anyway.
Secondly, the scenario is somewhat different in that play carries on pending the check and then results in a free kick and moves on.
Pens, it results in a retake and you can end up in an endless loop of retaking a penalty. Also, there's no change to how either side plays with offside. With pens, you'd force keepers to stay still longer to be sure of not being pulled up and therefore harming their chance of making a save.
Franchise FCSnowflake RoyalRoyal Rother
Well yes, but the same comment applies to the fractional VAR offsides
Couple of points there... firstly I don't agree with a milimeter based approach in offside anyway.
Secondly, the scenario is somewhat different in that play carries on pending the check and then results in a free kick and moves on.
Pens, it results in a retake and you can end up in an endless loop of retaking a penalty. Also, there's no change to how either side plays with offside. With pens, you'd force keepers to stay still longer to be sure of not being pulled up and therefore harming their chance of making a save.
Isn't that entirely the point ?
If, as you say, staying still longer means less penalties are saved, then by definition moving (against the laws of the game) gives the goalkeeper an advantage he shouldn't have.
by Snowflake Royal » 04 Feb 2020 13:09
Royal RotherSnowflake RoyalRoyal Rother
Well yes, but the same comment applies to the fractional VAR offsides
Couple of points there... firstly I don't agree with a milimeter based approach in offside anyway.
Secondly, the scenario is somewhat different in that play carries on pending the check and then results in a free kick and moves on.
Pens, it results in a retake and you can end up in an endless loop of retaking a penalty. Also, there's no change to how either side plays with offside. With pens, you'd force keepers to stay still longer to be sure of not being pulled up and therefore harming their chance of making a save.
Of course it’s a different scenario but your principle of millimetres in a microsecond being an irrelevance applies in both cases, especially so in offsides when it is often less clear when the ball actually leaves the foot of the passer.
by Snowflake Royal » 04 Feb 2020 13:11
SanguineFranchise FCSnowflake Royal Couple of points there... firstly I don't agree with a milimeter based approach in offside anyway.
Secondly, the scenario is somewhat different in that play carries on pending the check and then results in a free kick and moves on.
Pens, it results in a retake and you can end up in an endless loop of retaking a penalty. Also, there's no change to how either side plays with offside. With pens, you'd force keepers to stay still longer to be sure of not being pulled up and therefore harming their chance of making a save.
Isn't that entirely the point ?
If, as you say, staying still longer means less penalties are saved, then by definition moving (against the laws of the game) gives the goalkeeper an advantage he shouldn't have.
Like athletes might learn to 'anticipate' the starting gun (false starts are subject to a 0.100 seconds threshold), so goalkeepers are trying to time their movement off their line and to the side to give themselves the best possible chance of saving a penalty. The 'best' possible scenario for the keeper is that he moves off his line a millisecond after the kick is taken. But a) those margins are impossible to measure (a keeper's foot could be on and then off the line during the fraction of a second that the ball is in contact with the taker's boot), and b) the logical conclusion of enforcing the rule strictly and literally is that keepers are essentially stood still until the ball is nearly past them.
Snowflake RoyalRoyal RotherSnowflake Royal Couple of points there... firstly I don't agree with a milimeter based approach in offside anyway.
Secondly, the scenario is somewhat different in that play carries on pending the check and then results in a free kick and moves on.
Pens, it results in a retake and you can end up in an endless loop of retaking a penalty. Also, there's no change to how either side plays with offside. With pens, you'd force keepers to stay still longer to be sure of not being pulled up and therefore harming their chance of making a save.
Of course it’s a different scenario but your principle of millimetres in a microsecond being an irrelevance applies in both cases, especially so in offsides when it is often less clear when the ball actually leaves the foot of the passer.
And I said I don't agree with millimeters in offside anyway.
by Snowflake Royal » 04 Feb 2020 22:52
BR0B0TSnowflake RoyalRoyal Rother
Of course it’s a different scenario but your principle of millimetres in a microsecond being an irrelevance applies in both cases, especially so in offsides when it is often less clear when the ball actually leaves the foot of the passer.
And I said I don't agree with millimeters in offside anyway.
how do you measure it then
by stealthpapes » 05 Feb 2020 12:36
stealthpapes Can anyone help me with Shrewsbury's last night, please?
by Silver Fox » 05 Feb 2020 12:43
Silver Fox That's one of my big issues with VAR tbf, how far back is it worth looking at? It's mental that a corner can be given erroneously that a team could score from but VAR wouldn't be used to fix that clear and obvious error because the corner decision was such a long time before the goal.
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