Olise

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Re: Olise

by Crusader Royal » 14 Jun 2024 11:10

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Sutekh So more financial outgoings for Cheatsea, just when they're expected to be selling. If it did happen it'd be hilarious if the PL stepped in and stopped it (which is something all leagues should be doing to clubs that are "overstretching themselves").

Meanwhile though this does remain no more than gossip, so could be complete ******** anyway.
Chelsea sold land assets such as the hotel to another company with the same owners to bridge the gap.
This is legal in the Premier League, not in the EFL which is mostly how we got into this mess we find ourselves in.

As for player sales, the amortised the player transfer costs over 5 or 6 years so if they sold a player they would have to recognize the remaining 4 or 5 years of the costs now, This is why they sold Mason Mount, he cost them nothing so it was 100% accounting profit.


:roll: This exactly why football needs cleaning up, it is not acceptable to have two sets of financial rules governing what is effectively the same competition. IMO, the whole financial profit and sustainability governance should be run by an independent company that is dedicated to monitoring these processes across the whole 92 clubs and can flag up possible issues and breaches before they become serious.


Wouldn’t you have to apply it across the entire pyramid. There is automatic promotion and relegation the whole way down so the National League is as much the same competition as the FL as the FL is the same as the PL.

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Re: Olise

by Clyde1998 » 14 Jun 2024 11:33

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Forbury Lion Chelsea sold land assets such as the hotel to another company with the same owners to bridge the gap.
This is legal in the Premier League, not in the EFL which is mostly how we got into this mess we find ourselves in.

As for player sales, the amortised the player transfer costs over 5 or 6 years so if they sold a player they would have to recognize the remaining 4 or 5 years of the costs now, This is why they sold Mason Mount, he cost them nothing so it was 100% accounting profit.


:roll: This exactly why football needs cleaning up, it is not acceptable to have two sets of financial rules governing what is effectively the same competition. IMO, the whole financial profit and sustainability governance should be run by an independent company that is dedicated to monitoring these processes across the whole 92 clubs and can flag up possible issues and breaches before they become serious.


Wouldn’t you have to apply it across the entire pyramid. There is automatic promotion and relegation the whole way down so the National League is as much the same competition as the FL as the FL is the same as the PL.

I think I'm right in saying there's no FFP in the National League, so clubs in the NL can spend as much money as they like to build a squad and shoot up the FL once they get there (sanctions seem to be limited to a transfer embargo in L1/L2). You're right to say it needs to apply to the entire pyramid.

Ideally, there would be limits on certain types of expenditure based on revenue - with exceptions to infrastructure and youth development - on top of rules to take ownership away from owners that break rules. That latter point is why you'd need government regulation to make that legal.

I also think the women's game should be regulated in a similar way, as it seems to be going much the same way as the men's game in terms of excessive expenditure relative to the revenue generated.

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Re: Olise

by Forbury Lion » 14 Jun 2024 12:09

Clyde1998 I also think the women's game should be regulated in a similar way, as it seems to be going much the same way as the men's game in terms of excessive expenditure relative to the revenue generated.
Some teams use the Womens Team for a FFP fiddle.... such as splitting all the support costs like physios, training pitches etc 50/50 between the two when in reality the split isn't 50/50.
I guess also shirt sales/revenue from the womens team gets swept up into the mens with the shirt sponsor deal maybe worked so they pay £99.5m to be suppliers for the mens team and £500k to be suppliers for the womens team

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Re: Olise

by Whore Jackie » 14 Jun 2024 12:46

Slightly bemused that Olise might opt for Chelsea, given he turned them down last year, they've replaced Poch with Maresca, and since signed Cole Palmer in that right-wing position. Plus Palace have significantly upgraded their own manager. The sell-on money would be bloody handy, but surely there's better clubs he can move to.

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Re: Olise

by Hound » 14 Jun 2024 13:27

Whore Jackie Slightly bemused that Olise might opt for Chelsea, given he turned them down last year, they've replaced Poch with Maresca, and since signed Cole Palmer in that right-wing position. Plus Palace have significantly upgraded their own manager. The sell-on money would be bloody handy, but surely there's better clubs he can move to.


Guess that 8 year contract will be persuasive


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Re: Olise

by Franchise FC » 14 Jun 2024 13:33

Hound
Whore Jackie Slightly bemused that Olise might opt for Chelsea, given he turned them down last year, they've replaced Poch with Maresca, and since signed Cole Palmer in that right-wing position. Plus Palace have significantly upgraded their own manager. The sell-on money would be bloody handy, but surely there's better clubs he can move to.


Guess that 8 year contract will be persuasive

Pretty much guarantees him in excess of £40m (probably more like £60m+)
That would perhaps be a bit of a draw

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Re: Olise

by From Despair To Where? » 15 Jun 2024 09:27

I'm sure contracts used to be limited to 5 years.

Maybe they should be, renewable after 2.

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Re: Olise

by SpaghettiHoop » 15 Jun 2024 09:54

From Despair To Where? I'm sure contracts used to be limited to 5 years.

Maybe they should be, renewable after 2.


https://inews.co.uk/sport/football/chel ... ly-2439949

Loophole closed last year.

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Re: Olise

by Sutekh » 15 Jun 2024 10:12

Just wondering on the ramifications for the game if the authorites moved to outlaw any amortisation on player transfers and so effectively forced clubs to pay fees 100% up front. Hoping it would reduce the utterly ludicrous size of transfer fees that are a feature of the game these days and hopefully make clubs more responsible and perhaps to just go looking more for the stars in lower divisions rather than chasing the latest supposed "names" from across continents.


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Re: Olise

by Franchise FC » 15 Jun 2024 10:13

SpaghettiHoop
From Despair To Where? I'm sure contracts used to be limited to 5 years.

Maybe they should be, renewable after 2.


https://inews.co.uk/sport/football/chel ... ly-2439949

Loophole closed last year.

That doesn’t limit the length of a contract.
It limits the period over which the transfer fee can be amortised

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Re: Olise

by Franchise FC » 15 Jun 2024 10:14

Sutekh Just wondering on the ramifications for the game if the authorites moved to outlaw any amortisation on player transfers and so effectively forced clubs to pay fees 100% up front. Hoping it would reduce the utterly ludicrous size of transfer fees that are a feature of the game these days and hopefully make clubs more responsible and perhaps to just go looking more for the stars in lower divisions rather than chasing the latest supposed "names" from across continents.

Again, forcing immediate amortisation wouldn’t necessarily stop deferred payments
Cash =/= costs for calculating profit

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Re: Olise

by Lower West » 17 Jun 2024 16:27

Sutekh Just wondering on the ramifications for the game if the authorites moved to outlaw any amortisation on player transfers and so effectively forced clubs to pay fees 100% up front. Hoping it would reduce the utterly ludicrous size of transfer fees that are a feature of the game these days and hopefully make clubs more responsible and perhaps to just go looking more for the stars in lower divisions rather than chasing the latest supposed "names" from across continents.


Won't help clubs are lower levels either. The impact would ripple down the entire pyramid.

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Re: Olise

by Crusader Royal » 17 Jun 2024 18:18

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Sutekh Just wondering on the ramifications for the game if the authorites moved to outlaw any amortisation on player transfers and so effectively forced clubs to pay fees 100% up front. Hoping it would reduce the utterly ludicrous size of transfer fees that are a feature of the game these days and hopefully make clubs more responsible and perhaps to just go looking more for the stars in lower divisions rather than chasing the latest supposed "names" from across continents.


Won't help clubs are lower levels either. The impact would ripple down the entire pyramid.


Depends how far down you want to go. Not many non league teams pay transfer fees. Contracted players sometimes have release fees which amounts to the same thing I guess. For a non league club to get £5k up front rather than spread over 3 years would be significant although to be honest I don’t know if deferred payments are a thing at this level, I rather suspect not.


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Re: Olise

by Snowflake Royal » 17 Jun 2024 19:09

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Sutekh Just wondering on the ramifications for the game if the authorites moved to outlaw any amortisation on player transfers and so effectively forced clubs to pay fees 100% up front. Hoping it would reduce the utterly ludicrous size of transfer fees that are a feature of the game these days and hopefully make clubs more responsible and perhaps to just go looking more for the stars in lower divisions rather than chasing the latest supposed "names" from across continents.


Won't help clubs are lower levels either. The impact would ripple down the entire pyramid.


Depends how far down you want to go. Not many non league teams pay transfer fees. Contracted players sometimes have release fees which amounts to the same thing I guess. For a non league club to get £5k up front rather than spread over 3 years would be significant although to be honest I don’t know if deferred payments are a thing at this level, I rather suspect not.

Pretty sure we've discussed only recently that most L1 transfers aren't for fees.

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Re: Olise

by Crusader Royal » 18 Jun 2024 09:33

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Won't help clubs are lower levels either. The impact would ripple down the entire pyramid.


Depends how far down you want to go. Not many non league teams pay transfer fees. Contracted players sometimes have release fees which amounts to the same thing I guess. For a non league club to get £5k up front rather than spread over 3 years would be significant although to be honest I don’t know if deferred payments are a thing at this level, I rather suspect not.

Pretty sure we've discussed only recently that most L1 transfers aren't for fees.


I had assumed the point about ‘rippling down the pyramid’ related to clubs beyond the top few divisions.

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Re: Olise

by Snowflake Royal » 18 Jun 2024 09:50

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Depends how far down you want to go. Not many non league teams pay transfer fees. Contracted players sometimes have release fees which amounts to the same thing I guess. For a non league club to get £5k up front rather than spread over 3 years would be significant although to be honest I don’t know if deferred payments are a thing at this level, I rather suspect not.

Pretty sure we've discussed only recently that most L1 transfers aren't for fees.


I had assumed the point about ‘rippling down the pyramid’ related to clubs beyond the top few divisions.

Well yes, but that's countered by fees only really being paid regularly in the top 2. It can't ripple down if clubs generally aren't paying fees, only receiving them

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Re: Olise

by Crusader Royal » 18 Jun 2024 10:25

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Snowflake Royal Pretty sure we've discussed only recently that most L1 transfers aren't for fees.


I had assumed the point about ‘rippling down the pyramid’ related to clubs beyond the top few divisions.

Well yes, but that's countered by fees only really being paid regularly in the top 2. It can't ripple down if clubs generally aren't paying fees, only receiving them


Surely the ripple affects buyers AND sellers ? If a non league team sells a player for £10k to a Div2 side and the Div 2 side wants to pay over 3 years that impacts the seller negatively. If the money has to be paid up front it is a big benefit. Unintended consequences however might mean an offer of £10k over 3 years becomes £5k upfront

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Re: Olise

by Snowflake Royal » 18 Jun 2024 10:56

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I had assumed the point about ‘rippling down the pyramid’ related to clubs beyond the top few divisions.

Well yes, but that's countered by fees only really being paid regularly in the top 2. It can't ripple down if clubs generally aren't paying fees, only receiving them


Surely the ripple affects buyers AND sellers ? If a non league team sells a player for £10k to a Div2 side and the Div 2 side wants to pay over 3 years that impacts the seller negatively. If the money has to be paid up front it is a big benefit. Unintended consequences however might mean an offer of £10k over 3 years becomes £5k upfront

I think we're getting lost in the weeds rather.

I *think*the original point was that making fees be upfront would have negative effects rippling down the leagues a long way, when actually because fees are mostly paid in the top two division, the effect below them would actually be fairly positive.

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Re: Olise

by Orion1871 » 21 Jun 2024 20:06

David Ornstein Chelsea withdraw from race to sign Crystal Palace winger Michael Olise. CFC held talks with CPFC + 22yo but felt finances involved beyond reach - instead plan to reward existing players & new recruits


David Ornstein again Crystal Palace winger Michael Olise has decided to join Bayern Munich.

Bayern are now expected to agree a deal with Palace for the 22-year-old France youth international to put an end to speculation over his future this summer.

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Re: Olise

by WestYorksRoyal » 21 Jun 2024 21:12

For all his damage, many reputable staff members at the club are happy to go on record that Dai has never taken out a penny. So this Olise sell on will really help the club. Let's say it's £6m in total, I'd probably guess something like £3m up front and then £1m p.a., for 3 years.

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