Worst attacking options since January 2000

[CMRoyal]

Rasiak and Nhunt have to play together up front.

Agreed. I don't care what the formation is - 4-5-1, 4-4-2, 2-2-3-2-1 - or whatever BR called Donny's formation, those two will work well together I reckon. As for the other two? Can't see a long-term future for them here. Longy surely has to try to find first-choice football somewhere else and Church needs another loan spell at least, preferably with a League One team that creates plenty of chances for its strikers. We might have to take one or two loanees in ourselves in January - eg a Harewood or a Bent. Or Simon Cox!

[Vision]

and Siggurdson, none of whom seem to know how to play as supplementary attackers in Rodgers' preferred 4-3-3 system.

i woukld disagree vehemently about sigi, who has looked the best in that position all season
just behind the striker, not on the fecking wing

Vehemently deny it all you want but as thats not the position I'm talking about its a bit pointless.

I included him as the supplemetary strikers (wide forwards if you will) list which is where he played Saturday to little effect. Yet again a player playing in that crucial support position who didn't seem to know what the role is.

[rhroyal]

Worst options up front since 2000? I remember some seasons where Lloyd Owusu and Dean Morgan got a lot of games, or the times when Shaun Goater did nothing. Likewise Rougier used to play quite a few games for us. We had Kitson and Forster throughout a lot of these times, but I have memories of them being incapable of staying fit for more than a few games at a time and us having to fall back upon second rate strikers.

Nunt, Rasiak, Long, Church > Semi fit Kitson, semi fit Forster, Owusu, Morgan and Ferdinand.

[brendywendy]

and Siggurdson, none of whom seem to know how to play as supplementary attackers in Rodgers' preferred 4-3-3 system.

i woukld disagree vehemently about sigi, who has looked the best in that position all season
just behind the striker, not on the fecking wing

Vehemently deny it all you want but as thats not the position I'm talking about its a bit pointless.

I included him as the supplemetary strikers (wide forwards if you will) list which is where he played Saturday to little effect. Yet again a player playing in that crucial support position who didn't seem to know what the role is.

striker/winger then maybe
as i definitely think the attacking MF is supposed to play as a supplementary attacker too

[Vision]

Brendy, I'm not getting into an argument with you but I'd have thought its pretty obvious what I'm referring to in the players I listed. 4-3-3.

You're right of course Siggi has played well as the more attacking midfielder which is why I couldn't understand why he was moved out to one of the forward 3 in a 4-3-3.

[brendywendy]

Brendy, I'm not getting into an argument with you but I'd have thought its pretty obvious what I'm referring to in the players I listed. 4-3-3.

You're right of course Siggi has played well as the more attacking midfielder which is why I couldn't understand why he was moved out to one of the forward 3 in a 4-3-3.

wasnt arguing- apologies for misreading what you were saying

i agree hes been the best there all season
short of matejovski actually getting a full game to compare

[Vision]

Brendy, I'm not getting into an argument with you but I'd have thought its pretty obvious what I'm referring to in the players I listed. 4-3-3.

You're right of course Siggi has played well as the more attacking midfielder which is why I couldn't understand why he was moved out to one of the forward 3 in a 4-3-3.

wasnt arguing- apologies for misreading what you were saying

i agree hes been the best there all season
short of matejovski actually getting a full game to compare

Even then though it has to be said that be it Davies, Siggurdsson, Matejovsky or Howard playing it's created very little for a system in which it's designed.

[papereyes]

It could be argued that at the start of 2005/06 we had Kitson, Lita, Doyle & Long, only one of whom was even remotely proven at this level.

I'd like to think that the club had a bit more faith in a guy who'd scored 1 in 2 at this level the previous season and the then-club-record signing.

Yes, that's only two, but some of the revisionism over that strikeforce is pretty jaw-dropping. IMO.

Anyway, someone rightly mentions

Semi fit Kitson, semi fit Forster, Owusu, Morgan and Ferdinand.

and I think that would be worse.

But as also rightly said, in the post I partially quoted, its about the system. No point in attacking the striker if there's piss-all support from deep or wide. This is where the comment on 05/06 also founders as we had two of the best midfielders in the championship ably supporting in terms of performances and goals.

[Vision]

It could be argued that at the start of 2005/06 we had Kitson, Lita, Doyle & Long, only one of whom was even remotely proven at this level.

I'd like to think that the club had a bit more faith in a guy who'd scored 1 in 2 at this level the previous season and the then-club-record signing.

Yes, that's only two, but some of the revisionism over that strikeforce is pretty jaw-dropping. IMO.

Anyway, someone rightly mentions

Semi fit Kitson, semi fit Forster, Owusu, Morgan and Ferdinand.

and I think that would be worse.

But as also rightly said, in the post I partially quoted, its about the system. No point in attacking the striker if there's piss-all support from deep or wide. This is where the comment on 05/06 also founders as we had two of the best midfielders in the championship ably supporting in terms of performances and goals.

I'm mischief making a bit of course but the comment stands up.

The perception of those 4 at the start of the 05/06 season from a fair chunk of Reading fans (and indeed their track record at this level) was certainly no greater than the record of Rasiak, Hunt and Long at this stage. At the time Doyle hadn't played in England at any level, Long had only been playing football for a couple of years (and went straight into the Academy initially) and whilst being our record signing Lita was still not proven at this level. That really only left us with Kitson and he was injured before Ausgust without. That basically left us with Doyle & Lita from about the 5th game onwards with our only other forward option being Eric whatshisname on loan for a short period.

Of course as it turned out Doyle was a revelation but I'd suggest it's more jaw-dropping revisionism for people to suggest that they would have been happier at that stage of the season with those attacking options then where we are at now.

[Ian Royal]

There were rumours about Long (presumely from WUMs) that all the players took one look at him in training and decided he wasn't even good enough to play in a pub team and we'd been completely ripped off. Even taking into account he was a simple make weight deal.

So you can write him straight out of that strike force as worth anything. No one is saying that about Bignall, Church, or ... well Long this time around.

Three of our strikers have a fairly decent record at this level. Compared to one who had an excellent record t this level and another with an excellent, if brief record at the level below.

Get the supporting 3, 4 or 5 right and we'll score goals and win games.

[roberto_11]

Nunt, Rasiak, Long, Church > Semi fit Kitson, semi fit Forster, Owusu, Morgan and Ferdinand.

Don't forget Shaun Goater was still around in 2004/5. oxf*rd waste of space he was

[papereyes]

There were rumours about Long (presumely from WUMs) that all the players took one look at him in training and decided he wasn't even good enough to play in a pub team and we'd been completely ripped off. Even taking into account he was a simple make weight deal.

It was either Kes or Tredder who came up with that one.

[Thaumagurist*]

There were rumours about Long (presumely from WUMs) that all the players took one look at him in training and decided he wasn't even good enough to play in a pub team and we'd been completely ripped off. Even taking into account he was a simple make weight deal.

It was either Kes or Tredder who came up with that one.

Think it was Tredder.

[Terminal Boardom]

What Rodgers needs to do is select a team that will create chances and put the opposition under pressure. 11 players to be selected who can perform as a cohesive unit and show some flair, adaptability and intelligence. Home games are there to be won. So go and win some!

[Hoop Blah]

Noel Hunt, Raziak, Long, Church - have we ever had a worse selection of forwards?

Well yes, but not, I would say, since January 2000 when we were labouring along with Scott, Williams, McIntyre and an unfit Forster.

In February 2000, we signed Martin Butler and since that point have always had forwards that looked capable of scoring and at least one that might get 20 plus in a season. I look at the current crop and doubt any will score 20 and also doubt more than one of them will get to double figures.

I like Hunt but in no way is he suited to a lone striker role and he won't be creating many chances himself. Raziak is a Championship journeyman and Long and Church are not up to it at this level.

The fight for survival starts here and it's all about games like yesterday's and scrabbling enough points together to limp home. Two years ago we were thumping Liverpool. That's the brick by brick for you.

Enjoy

Totally agree we have been left with a lack of firepower but I really don't like the tone of the brick by brick jibe.

As for the agruement over formation and going back to a 4-4-2, there are two big problems with that. Firstly, as under Pardew, we don't have the central midfielders to cope with playing with just two in the middle. No combination of many central midfielders strike me as good enough to compete against the average sides let alone the better ones, especially in these days of 4-5-1 and 4-3-3 being a popular formation.

Secondly, we don't have wingers good enough to both defend AND attack and still be a creative force. We've seen that over the last 2 years since Convey and Little last made meaningful contributions. We've only added in McAnuf and given the kids a chance to impress and that's not going to make up for our short comings there.

What's left? A difficult period where we wait for the system to bed in and the youngsters to develop into players capable of producing at this level, or of course, we add more to the squad when we get the chance.

[Ian Royal]

There were rumours about Long (presumely from WUMs) that all the players took one look at him in training and decided he wasn't even good enough to play in a pub team and we'd been completely ripped off. Even taking into account he was a simple make weight deal.

It was either Kes or Tredder who came up with that one.

Didn't say they were credible rumours.

[Hoop Blah]

Dont put words in my mouth by saying the change in formation will automatically solve anything.
However playing some-one ill-suited to the lone striker position like Noel Hunt is not going to result in postive results. He is not the most mobile player to play that role is he now.

Isn't the most mobile?

Apart from the ability to hang in the air which makes him an excellent threat in the air, I'd say his mobility and work are his main strength.

He's still not going to be a force to be reckoned with upfront on his own though, I agree on that point.

[Terminal Boardom]

There were rumours about Long (presumely from WUMs) that all the players took one look at him in training and decided he wasn't even good enough to play in a pub team and we'd been completely ripped off. Even taking into account he was a simple make weight deal.

It was either Kes or Tredder who came up with that one.

Didn't say they were credible rumours.

I vaguely recall some comments made upon the club and management seeing Long in training for the first time. Apparently, he looked as if he had never played football before! EVER!!!

[Royal Lady]

I don't think he had been playing football for very long tbf to him, he was more into hurling wasn't it?

[Ian Royal]

Dont put words in my mouth by saying the change in formation will automatically solve anything.
However playing some-one ill-suited to the lone striker position like Noel Hunt is not going to result in postive results. He is not the most mobile player to play that role is he now.

Isn't the most mobile?

Apart from the ability to hang in the air which makes him an excellent threat in the air, I'd say his mobility and work are his main strength.

He's still not going to be a force to be reckoned with upfront on his own though, I agree on that point.

I think he could be if he can get support of decent quality from those "wingers" and a central midfielder.

That's been sadly lacking in all but the Barnsley game.

I think Rodgers' biggest mistake on the field so far, has been making so many changes to a winning team. Something obviously worked, and worked reasonably well against Barnsley. Obviously Cummings had to come in, and O'Dea did fine. But switching Siggurdsson to the left, Kebe to the right and dropping HRK for Howard didn't seem the smartest move IMO.