The table doesn't lie.

[Hampshire Royal]

Well yes, that's true, you're only six points above relegation after all.

[Tredder]

3 wins off the play offs, glass half full mentality.

[Hampshire Royal]

9 points off play offs, 6 points off relegation, surely that's a 'glass 40% full' mentality? Still, it's a better attitude than that shown by many Reading fans on here.

[Royal Lady]

Schards and I certainly shan't feel any gratification or pleasure if we get relegated. And I don't know why you're singling me out re buying other players Hampshire Royal. Fact is, we could have got someone like Neil Lennon, or Cahill - both went to teams that we should be able to compete with both in terms of fees and wages. I've said on here time and again, if we play our hearts out and still lose (like against Man Utd) - you can't ask for any more, and it's unfortunate. I wasn't at the game yesterday, but from comments on here and highlights I've seen, I'd say we didn't play like a team desperate to avoid relegation, nor did we play to each player's very best ability - that is always the crux of the matter for me. Last season, I expected us to play out of our skins, but not achieve much as were up against the big boys in terms of player names and money. We far exceeded what I ever thought we capable of. This season, however, I didn't expect us to be struggling near the foot of the table. Nor, I suspect, did most of the others on here, RTGs or not.

[Hampshire Royal]

I'm not singling you out, RL, it's just that you'r typical of those that say that we could and should have bought players/ It's just that yours was the last post I read that said that. I can understand whay you thought hat, and I'm sorry, because you at least can put two words together.

The point I was trying to make is that you just can't go to 'Footballers are Us' and buy whoever you like. It's not just a question of paying the fees and wages, it may also be the perception of ambition. Whether we like it or not, we will always be seen as 'l'il ole Reading' by the sort of player we would be interested in. If you were Cahill and had a choice of us and Bolton, both (we'll assume) paying the same wages, who would you choose? A team that is still in the EUFA cup, so clearly has the ambition to succeed, or a team that is not even going to extend their small (by Prem standards) stadium. Maybe if we'd have qualified for Europe last season, instead of Bolton, things would have been different. I don't accept for one moment that Coppell didn't want us to qualify, even though he said that we didn't as a means of trying to keep down expectations of all at the club. If we had, we would have been able to buy more, better players in August and would have been able to say that we would definitely extend the ground. If we'd still been in Europe in January we would have been able to buy yet more good players.

[rfc58]

Personally, this whole mess could have been avoided if the chairman was prepared to invest some of the money the club is currently enjoying, but seems the saviour of the club is now holding the club back.

He is a very shrewd business man, and he knows that currently, it can't get any better financially, top dollar through the gates, and top dollar in via the telly money, coupled with the fact that to get to this current position, he has done it very much on the cheap, but if you only allow your manager to pay "Championsip" wages, don't be surprised if all you can attract is that type of player. He bleats on about selling, well Mr Chairman, if you can't attract a buyer after the clubs rise to fame, then either you are asking too much or you have another agenda !!

Gilkes came out with a comment after the home defeat to Pompey, he said that we have a similar income to them, and 12 months ago, were similar to them on the pitch, but they invested to enhance their chances of enjoying the money the top flight offers, but what did we do ??

[Millsy]

Indeed the table doesn't lie:

Pl HW HD HL HF HA AW AD AL AF AA POINTS GD
1 Arsenal 25 11 2 0 29 8 7 4 1 23 10 60 +34
2 Man Utd 25 12 1 0 31 3 6 3 3 18 9 58 +37
3 Chelsea 25 8 4 0 23 8 8 2 3 15 9 54 +21
4 Everton 25 7 2 3 23 11 6 3 4 17 12 44 +17
5 Aston Villa 24 7 2 4 20 16 4 6 1 23 15 41 +12
6 Man City 25 9 3 1 21 11 2 5 5 11 17 41 +4
7 Liverpool 23 4 6 1 23 9 6 4 2 14 8 40 +20
8 Blackburn 25 5 4 4 13 13 5 5 2 19 18 39 +1
9 Portsmouth 25 3 7 2 15 10 7 1 5 20 16 38 +9
10 West Ham 24 5 4 3 15 12 5 2 5 14 10 36 +7
11 Tottenham 25 6 2 4 33 22 1 6 6 12 19 29 +4
12 Newcastle 24 5 4 3 16 17 2 2 8 11 25 27 -15
13 Bolton 25 5 4 4 17 11 1 3 8 9 23 25 -8
14 Middlesbro 24 3 4 5 13 18 3 3 6 8 19 25 -16
15 Wigan 25 5 2 5 15 14 1 3 9 9 26 23 -16
16 Sunderland 24 6 3 3 15 13 0 2 10 9 29 23 -18
17 READING 25 6 1 6 14 19 0 3 9 16 33 22 -22
18 Birmingham 25 3 4 5 13 14 2 2 9 11 23 21 -13
19 Fulham 24 2 5 5 16 21 0 5 7 7 21 16 -19
20 Derby 25 1 3 8 8 21 0 3 10 5 31 9 -39

[Coppelled Streets]

Gilkes came out with a comment after the home defeat to Pompey, he said that we have a similar income to them, and 12 months ago, were similar to them on the pitch, but they invested to enhance their chances of enjoying the money the top flight offers, but what did we do ??

Great post!!

And to enhance that opinion, our income is greater I would think as we have a larger capacity, even when we aren't filling it due to the poor run of form we're still beating Pompey's attendances, and we have the hotel income, conference centre......

[Hampshire Royal]

None of us really know the reason why we haven't bought good players (except of course Matejovsky, Cisse and Fae - who I am assured by an Ivoirean acquaintenance of mine is a very good player) but I personally don't think that it's to do with wages or fees. Kevin Dillon who is at least an honest man, said that there is no ceiling on either and it is other reasons why players choose not to come here.

[Volvicanus]

For what it's worth, I think we'll survive this and stay up this season.

It looks horrible now but I certainly don't think you can look at our fixtures and be assured of what the outcome is based on what people would normally expect. We shouldn't have beat Liverpool - we did. We shouldn't have done as well as we did against Man U - we did. We're not a typcial team in that regard so judging it on that basis isn't sound.

Mentally, I think we have a pretty sound team (or to be more accurate we have proved that we have the ability to pull that aspect together quite admirably) and I think we have the personel to pull it off - just. I'm encouraged that perhaps Mate will bring some needed order to the midfield. I remain utterly convinced that we can score as long as Lita is off the pitch and I have a bit more confidence in our defensive these days since Cisse has stepped in.

I think a lot of the teams around us are benefiting from the lift that comes from getting a new manager and having players think, for a short while, that things will be SO much better. Rarely they are all that different and previous patterns emerge after a few games.

So yes - table don't lie, but they do change. And I think that table will in the next month.

Finally, as long as Mr Mad is looking to sell we are going to continue to struggle like this. That seems obvious to me. Mr Mad's tendencies run towards the frugal side - and every business instinct in him will be telling him not to spend money on something that he's trying to offload. He's simply doing a 'House Doctor', Ann Maurice style on the club until then.

[1960]

What depresses me is that we've come out of a frighteningly difficult period of 6 matches with only a point and should have been ready to kick on. And we lose to bloddy Bolton. Coppell goes on about them being a big team and difficult to play, but their last 12 away opponents didn't bother about that. Not a single away win before yesterday. And when little Sam was stuggling at the beginning of the season who was the only team they beat? Yes, Reading.

I'm really worried about this. If we can't beat Bolton who are we going to beat? Even Fulham got a 0-0 at the Reebok. I can see Fulham going on a bit of a run with all their new players and Brum only kept us out of the bottom three by letting in a late goal by Derby.

We've played quite well against some of the better teams - so what is the reason we play crap against a more limited team?

Things are looking bleak and I DON'T want Reading to be relegated. Can we ever hope for a miraculous change in form and shoot up the table?

[Victor Meldrew]

HR,
If we do get relegated you can have my away season ticket.
I'll renew the home one because that is what I do every other Saturday,travel up to Reading,see a few of the family and friends and go to watch our team.
The away trips,other than to Southampton,Plymouth and a few others will not be on my agenda and I suspect that some others will feel the same.

[Hampshire Royal]

Actually, Victor, you may as well let me have your home ST. OK, visiting family may be OK - but how much time do you spend with them? As for friends, do me a favour. Just how many have you got?

[RoyalBlue]

I'm not singling you out, RL, it's just that you'r typical of those that say that we could and should have bought players/ It's just that yours was the last post I read that said that. I can understand whay you thought hat, and I'm sorry, because you at least can put two words together.

The point I was trying to make is that you just can't go to 'Footballers are Us' and buy whoever you like. It's not just a question of paying the fees and wages, it may also be the perception of ambition. Whether we like it or not, we will always be seen as 'l'il ole Reading' by the sort of player we would be interested in. If you were Cahill and had a choice of us and Bolton, both (we'll assume) paying the same wages, who would you choose? A team that is still in the EUFA cup, so clearly has the ambition to succeed, or a team that is not even going to extend their small (by Prem standards) stadium. Maybe if we'd have qualified for Europe last season, instead of Bolton, things would have been different. I don't accept for one moment that Coppell didn't want us to qualify, even though he said that we didn't as a means of trying to keep down expectations of all at the club. If we had, we would have been able to buy more, better players in August and would have been able to say that we would definitely extend the ground. If we'd still been in Europe in January we would have been able to buy yet more good players.

I'm sorry but the little old Reading thing is a load of Madjeski b*llocks and a convenient excuse/cover for lack of investment. If you want any further proof of that, just look at Wigan. You couldn't have got more little or unfashionable when they went up, yet it didn't stop them signing plenty of good players.

He can't have it both ways. Either footballers are a bunch of overpaid mercenaries just interested in picking up their fat pay check or they look at things in a far broader way and select their team using other criteria such as how big/fashionable the club are.

Yes, if the money is the same they will look at other factors but had we been prepared to trump the fee and wages offered by Bolton for Cahill does anyone really think he would have turned us down merely because we are little old Reading?!

[cmonurz]

Good posts, HR. I understand your points, even though I disagree with many of them, and I certainly don't have the dexterity to write something equally pointed from my point of view. I think a question though, that sums up where a lot of us are coming from is whether the net improvement of the team since promotion (essentially, and based only on 2 games, the signing of Matejovsky) is really adequate/sufficient for 20 months in the top flight. I could buy the 'unable to attract the right players/wages/the right players not available' argument for 6 months, even a year, given our complete lack of reputation at this level, but in finishing 8th last season we gave ourselves such a good springboard in that respect, and it doesn't appear to have been used.

Just as worrying as the current situation for me is, if we do stay up, who in their right mind will join us this July, if we weren't much of a proposition last summer?

Can we really not attract Matt Taylor to this club? Or Gary Cahill? Really? Or is Coppell not being given the backing to do so?

[Southbank Old Boy]

Gilkes came out with a comment after the home defeat to Pompey, he said that we have a similar income to them, and 12 months ago, were similar to them on the pitch, but they invested to enhance their chances of enjoying the money the top flight offers, but what did we do ??

Great post!!

And to enhance that opinion, our income is greater I would think as we have a larger capacity, even when we aren't filling it due to the poor run of form we're still beating Pompey's attendances, and we have the hotel income, conference centre......

Pompey have had Gaydemack bank rolling them and throwing money at their wage bill though. It's not the same situation as us.

[Hampshire Royal]

Can you imagine the outrage on this board if we'd signed Campbell (past it, unstable etc) or James (cr@p keeper, makes too many stupid mistakes etc) or Kanu (over-rated, past it etc).

[Platypuss]

Can you imagine the outrage on this board if we'd signed Campbell (past it, unstable etc) or James (cr@p keeper, makes too many stupid mistakes etc) or Kanu (over-rated, past it etc).

No, as it happens. And I'm pretty sure their performances would have done the talking anyway.

[Hampshire Royal]

Good performances don't stop people on here having a go at Hahnemann, Shorey and (in some cases) Hunt.

[Royal Lady]

Good performances don't stop people on here having a go at Hahnemann, Shorey and (in some cases) Hunt.

As far as I'm aware, people only ever moan at players when they've played badly and that's fair enough. We're all more than happy to give them praise when we feel they've done well - see Matejovsky yesterday for example.