RUMOUR - kris boyd

[Victor Meldrew]

If history and size of team was a consideration, why did someone like Valencia go to Wigan???

I suggest that what motivates a player in moving to a club in the Championship are the following items in order...

1. Weekly salary
2. signing on fee
3. bonuses
4. chance of promotion to Premiership leading to an increase of numbers 1 and 3.

With Kris Boyd I suspect that he would be interested in Brum because of McLeish - don't forget he was a respected Scottish National Manager.

Perhaps Valencia went there because whereas Mihailov thought we played at Wembley Valencia thought that Wigan was a top football club rather than a rugby league side.
Seriously though what a great signing -we were really impressed with him when they gave us the runaround at their place and when Lita missed that sitterfrom about 2 yards.
I hope factor no.4 comes into play for us in this transfer window because we may just fall down under 1,2 and 3-or at least that's what everybody says whether true or not.

[FiNeRaIn]

That's genius Although he's probably just notched against inverness or someone dump.

Goal to game ratio is actually astonishing, no matter what level you play at

[Sun Tzu]

Were they itnernationals before they joined? No, not in most cases at all.
We can't attract anyone, I widely remember david connelly going " um no thanks, big club for me please", same with joleon lescott. Couple of months later everton sign him. Players don't want to play for us, we don't offer ambition or a high pay packet.

That's a rather weak case - Lescott picks Everton over us !

The Coppell discussion was that it was not easy to get players to come and look at the club, but once they had seen the set up they were keen. Based on the well known fact that we don't come near the top of the wage table it's kind of consistent with what has been said earlier. Nigel Howe also made the point that because we don't pay top wages we try and do more for players in other ways (facilities, the way we look after them etc etc).

You also forget that Coppell is not a 'big name' player. He's being incredibly successful using his sort of players and whilst one or two fans may be silly enough to think a player is only worth signing if his wedding was in Hello and he's shagging a page 3 girl I think you are probably in a minority in that. It would be interesting to hear your theories on how big club Birmingham with their massive history and endless ambition have managed to get so far ahead of us in recent seasons....

[FiNeRaIn]

You also forget that Coppell is not a 'big name' player. He's being incredibly successful using his sort of players and whilst one or two fans may be silly enough to think a player is only worth signing if his wedding was in Hello and he's shagging a page 3 girl I think you are probably in a minority in that.

I'm not in a minority in that because i've never said that, get your facts straight, stop making up opinions on my behalf.
I want us to sign the 3 young kids from southampton, will we? Probably not as we lack ambition.
I would like us to sign recognised quality players instead of cheapo's like bennett and mooney, this doesn't mean people shagging page 3 models, stop being so melodramatic.

[Sun Tzu]

Probably not as we lack ambition.

stop being so melodramatic.

It's great that someone with such a narrow minded yet deliberately stupid line in posting can accuse others of being 'melodramatic' !

[FiNeRaIn]

Probably not as we lack ambition.

stop being so melodramatic.

It's great that someone with such a narrow minded yet deliberately stupid line in posting can accuse others of being 'melodramatic' !

Net money spend this season on transferrs? Thought so.

My statement is fairly realistic, yours is laughably over dramatic.

[TBM]

McLeish says the Boyd deal is "dead"

[Hoop Blah]

If history and size of team was a consideration, why did someone like Valencia go to Wigan???

I suggest that what motivates a player in moving to a club in the Championship are the following items in order...

1. Weekly salary
2. signing on fee
3. bonuses
4. chance of promotion to Premiership leading to an increase of numbers 1 and 3.

With Kris Boyd I suspect that he would be interested in Brum because of McLeish - don't forget he was a respected Scottish National Manager.

I agree that your points 1-3 are spot on....that's why I've said that the perception of the club only really comes into account when the financial packages are round and about equal.

I think your point 4 is reasonably close too, although I think just as big a consideration is how quickly the club can help them move on to a bigger and better (and more lucrative club elsewhere). Career development if you like.

As for Valencia, I would guess he went to Wigan because they were the only Premiership club that were in for him at the time. Or perhaps Wigan were just the ones offering the most cash.

[Hoop Blah]

Reading are perceived as a small time club on the up.

That's probably not as appealing to a player as a club with a history and image of a more passionate footballing city.

I'm sure if I were a player and not a Reading fan I'd probably rather play (money being equal) for someone like Stoke or Birmingham than a Reading or Wigan. It might not be right but I'm sure that's the perception.

On the basis of your being a professional footballer I'll bow to your superior knowledge then ! I suspect the fact that Birmingham won the League Cup in the early 60's has a massive bearing on how a player in his early 20's decides who to sign for !

I also think your idea of how Reading might be perceived is several years out of date. Birmingham could be said to be perceived as a club run by a bunch of crooks totally overshadowed by their massively bigger and more successful local rivals who talk a better game than they actually deliver.

It's not about what they have or haven't won, it's about the way the club is. It's a big city club, and has that air of being a big club about it.

We all know that our little club is every bit as well set up to bring about a bit of success and that we're run much better and our crowds are similar size etc etc, but the perception for the rest of the country is that Birmingham are a sleeping giant in a potential hotbed of football, with a traditional hard core of support. The perception of Reading is that we're a very middle class, well to do, try not to upset too many people kind of club who are happy to try and compete with the big boys as long as it doesnt require too much money being thrown at it.

[royal tee]

[quote="FiNeRaIn]
I would like us to sign recognised quality players[/quote]

Like Doyle, Kitson, Hunt(s), Harper, Sonko, Bikey, Shorey all were.

I guess the obsession with people wanting signings that are "proven" players will never end, despite all the evidence that that isn't a) the only successful way to build a team and b) it is absolutley not Coppell's/Reading's way.

Continue bleating on and on and banging your head against a brick wall though

[Hoop Blah]

I would like us to sign recognised quality players

Like Doyle, Kitson, Hunt(s), Harper, Sonko, Bikey, Shorey all were.

I guess the obsession with people wanting signings that are "proven" players will never end, despite all the evidence that that isn't a) the only successful way to build a team and b) it is absolutley not Coppell's/Reading's way.

Continue bleating on and on and banging your head against a brick wall though

The difference being is that I think the people wanting us to sign 'proven players' is because we need some immediate strengthening, especially if we lose any players during this window.

Pretty much all of the players you've listed there took at least 6 months to really settle into the swing of things and really produce the impact we need. Players for the future are all well and good (Kebe and Cisse are having a positive impact at the moment) but last January we needed players capable of helping us pull ourselves out of the relegation battle. Likewise we could do with a couple of players to help us strengthen now like our competitors will no doubt be looking to do.

.....the obvious arguement against your list is Sodje, Bennett, Halls, Mooney (so far) etc etc but that is the market we have to try and exploit. Personally I think it would be sensible to also try and bing in a few of the proven variety alongside the cheaper gambles (if possible).

[royal tee]

I would like us to sign recognised quality players

Like Doyle, Kitson, Hunt(s), Harper, Sonko, Bikey, Shorey all were.

I guess the obsession with people wanting signings that are "proven" players will never end, despite all the evidence that that isn't a) the only successful way to build a team and b) it is absolutley not Coppell's/Reading's way.

Continue bleating on and on and banging your head against a brick wall though

The difference being is that I think the people wanting us to sign 'proven players' is because we need some immediate strengthening, especially if we lose any players during this window.

Pretty much all of the players you've listed there took at least 6 months to really settle into the swing of things and really produce the impact we need. Players for the future are all well and good (Kebe and Cisse are having a positive impact at the moment) but last January we needed players capable of helping us pull ourselves out of the relegation battle. Likewise we could do with a couple of players to help us strengthen now like our competitors will no doubt be looking to do.

.....the obvious arguement against your list is Sodje, Bennett, Halls, Mooney (so far) etc etc but that is the market we have to try and exploit. Personally I think it would be sensible to also try and bing in a few of the proven variety alongside the cheaper gambles (if possible).

But one of the main strengths of the team is the team spirit and the method of play. I don't think there are many signings we could make that would slot straight in as regular first team starter.

I absolutely accept what you say about Sodje et al but at the same time the argument for signing "proven" players can be rebutted with a list comprising Fae, Halford and you could even argue Lita. If you cast the net wider I am sure there are other clubs who have bought what are thought to be "proven" players that have not turned out as expected.

I just get wound up by this argument for "proven" players - I just don't think there is such a thing

[Hoop Blah]

The three you've quoted were not proven players.

All three represented a gamble on taking players from a lower level of football and hoping they'd pay off at the higher (maybe just different in Fae's case) level of football.

All transfers represent a gamble. Getting a player in who's shown they can play at the level your asking them to play at just reduces the risk.

Players like Marvin Elliot or Wayne Routledge would be proven at this level and, from what I've seen of them on the pitch, would suit our style of play. Off the field it might be a different story of course, but good management is the ability to get those different players to play well, and to their maximum, together.

This legendary team spirit and togetherness that you talk about...where was that last season or over the summer?

[FiNeRaIn]

[

On re-reading i was on the phone and not paying attetion fully to your post but, for every one of those players listed there have been plenty of flops. You can't build a team of cheap players consistently, why not sign proven young players like the lads at southampton? Lallana, mcgoldrick or surman?

[Wycombe Royal]

what was proven by bikey being a reserve in russia?
What was proven by hunt and sonko playing for a team in league one, hunt had been relseased on a free and deemed surplus to requirements by brentford?

I don't think Bikey was a reserve in Russia, but I may be wrong. And Hunt wasn't deemed surplus to requirements at Brentford - they couldn't afford to keep him.

[Hoop Blah]

what was proven by bikey being a reserve in russia?
What was proven by hunt and sonko playing for a team in league one, hunt had been relseased on a free and deemed surplus to requirements by brentford?

I don't think Bikey was a reserve in Russia, but I may be wrong. And Hunt wasn't deemed surplus to requirements at Brentford - they couldn't afford to keep him.

I'm sure he wasn't getting in the side around the time he left and they decided not to offer him a contract.

That might've been down to him asking for more than they thought he was worth, but not sure it was just as straight forward as not being able to afford him.

If he was that proven at the time I think he'd have had more options than just Bradford before we nipped in there!

[bottom left hand corner]

Don’t think we would pay over 3.5m like brum are supposedly bidding

[brendywendy]

i wouldnt really want to

[Deathy]

Don’t think we would pay over 3.5m like brum are supposedly bidding

Pay over? LOL. Wouldn't pay half that at this level.

Where's Ian Royal?

[Royalwaster]

The only point of signing a 'proven' player is if he's going to slot straight into the team - otherwise, he'll not want to join just to sit on the bench. The advantage of signing unproven players is that they are generally more willing to wait for their chance and won't moan at SC's usual tactic of playing them in the reserves for a season before allowing them a sniff of first team football. The problem is I can't really think of a single player who deserves to be dropped - so if we did a sign a 'proven' player, there'd be no obvious place for him to slot in. It's partly why I'd be surprised if Hreidarsson really joins us. Unless SC thinks he's better than Ingi or Doobs. He's hardly going to drop Armstrong is he?