Harte is Rubbish, not good enough for the Championship

[RoyalX]

I'm confused. When we could defend, but not score goals having a solid defence was the way to do well in this division. Now it's clear Harte is better attacking yet more suspect defensively, he shouldn't be taken out of the team because of what he offers going forwards.

Surely this is contradictory?

[Terminal Boardom]

I'm confused. When we could defend, but not score goals having a solid defence was the way to do well in this division. Now it's clear Harte is better attacking yet more suspect defensively, he shouldn't be taken out of the team because of what he offers going forwards.

Surely this is contradictory?

Sadly, he offered 3/4 of 7/8 of bugger all going forward on Saturday

[Snowball]

I'm confused. When we could defend, but not score goals having a solid defence was the way to do well in this division. Now it's clear Harte is better attacking yet more suspect defensively, he shouldn't be taken out of the team because of what he offers going forwards.

Surely this is contradictory?

Sadly, he offered 3/4 of 7/8 of bugger all going forward on Saturday

That must be why he SCORED then. Duh!

[Snowball]

Just so's you know Hoop. I Googled Harte and Dive and I found the bleating Man U manager, and one hanger-on (who admitted to a two-footed challenge on Harte)

I have found absolutely NO OTHER REFERENCE to Harte diving, anywhere in the last 15 years
Except there was some psycho on HNA who sees Irish players failing when they aren't even on the pitch.
He (apparently) alleges some kind of hand-waving gesture, on radio.
Did you find any other evidence, anything in 15 years of playing career, some other little hint of poor sportsmanship, Hoop?
I could really do with some help here, otherwise I will be forced to say Harte is NOT a cheat, and that would be AWFUL.

Hey Hoop, did you find any other references?

15 years to search across. Really, I couldn't find anything other than that which I posted.

So I guess we are agreed then, very, VERY little public evidence that Harte is a cheat or a diver.

I think you would agree, being a fair man, that two suspect accusations in 15 years, is not much of a case?


Best Wishes


Snow

[Ian Royal]

How many do other players have? If the majority have none it could be quite a lot taken in some actual context. And I rather thought that the point was there were some, rather than none.

And there's still the footage of him trying to get an opposition player sent off in a game for us earlier this season.

I happen to not believe he was deliberately feigning injury to get a player sent off. But as usual, you're on rather dodgy ground.

[Snowball]

But you KNOW nothing.

Neither do you but that doesn't stop you spouting your crap all day everyday claiming it all to be facts and statistically proven.

I don't understand why you believe yourself to be superior to everyone else when you have been shown up, had stats torn apart and challenges met time and time again.......

I admire your willingness to never accept defeat and it is a good characteristic to have if you are a professional sportsperson but on a forum it make you look very stupid.

Dear Whicker

When I don't KNOW something, I try very hard not to just guess, or make an assertion without foundation
and then act as if it is fact. For all you may decry my ise of statistics, at least I TRY to gather evidence.

Whether I have it right or wrong is not really the point. The point is I do NOT just spout.
I try to back my beliefs (I often FORM my beliefs) based on real evidence.


I know it's very, VERY hard for you to take, but just saying something doesn't make it true.

And if a million people say something, it's still no truer.

Once 99.999999% of people thought the earth was flat. You probably still do.

[RoyalX]

I'm confused. When we could defend, but not score goals having a solid defence was the way to do well in this division. Now it's clear Harte is better attacking yet more suspect defensively, he shouldn't be taken out of the team because of what he offers going forwards.

Surely this is contradictory?

Sadly, he offered 3/4 of 7/8 of bugger all going forward on Saturday

That must be why he SCORED then. Duh!

Please can you answer my question? I am at a loss.

[Ian Royal]

Sometimes it's better to use no evidence and stick to opinion, than to use crap, limited or selective evidence. That way at least you're not trying to give something undue or misleading weight and being honest.

crap, limited or selective stats can be less than worthless.

[Snowball]

How many do other players have? If the majority have none it could be quite a lot taken in some actual context. And I rather thought that the point was there were some, rather than none.

And there's still the footage of him trying to get an opposition player sent off in a game for us earlier this season.

I happen to not believe he was deliberately feigning injury to get a player sent off. But as usual, you're on rather dodgy ground.

Oh, Ian you are such a squeaky little child. If you think one dodgy reference, one verbal insult, one allegation by a very miffed manager
whose player WAS disciplined and a penalty WAS awarded, ONE such incident in FIFTEEN years is some real sort of evidence, you, really,
truly are dumb. How many incidents can you think of watching Reading (or should I say listening to the radio?) can you think of where
an opposition player (or indeed a different RFC player) has allegedly dived/

There will be many, many, well up in the tens if not a hundred or more. And in 15 years you find one against Harte and that makes him somehow the Devil incarnate?

These days the TV pundits (man of whom are players or managers) will say, "If he feels contact in the box, of course he's going to go down."

Is that not "cheating"?

Gerard?

Ronaldo?

Every Argentinian ever born?

Long, according to plenty (and more than once)

Search Results

Redknapp tells Man Utd striker Chicharito to stop diving .
Tottenham boss Redknapp unhappy with Nasri dive | Premiership News ...
Yeovil player stands by Kewell 'dive' claim - Premier League
Paul Jewell says "Allow Diving"


Diving is so widespread that there is a website dedicated to studying it: http://www.premiershipcheat.com/categor ... -analysis/

And you have one very dodgy allegation against Harte in FIFTEEN years, and your own "interpretation" of a fuzzy internet highlight.

[Snowball]

Sometimes it's better to use no evidence and stick to opinion, than to use crap, limited or selective evidence. That way at least you're not trying to give something undue or misleading weight and being honest. crap, limited or selective stats can be less than worthless.

OR, when you don't KNOW, you could simply not volunteer a useless guess

[Ian Royal]

I didn't find any articles. Every username on here other than yours are not just one person, but in fact many. Try and keep track.

I'm not saying he tried to get Holt sent off by feigning injury. You made a statement that you were not aware of Harte having a reputation of cheating from anyone. An article was found showing that in fact there is at least one out there.

You can be as petty and childish as you like. But it is a fact that Harte approached the referee in one of our games and waved an imaginary card at him, essentially demanding he send the opposition player off. That certainly is poor sportsmanship and something that shouldn't happen. Does it mean he dived and feigned injury? No. But it isn't exactly a ringing endorsement of his character.

Rather than being such a blinkered, intransigent, argumentative, dictatorial, rude and aggressive contributor, perhaps you should consider actually engaging in an adult discussion once in a while.

[Snowball]

Here is the foul by Barthez on Harte. A dive? Really?

Happy to hear people say they got that one wrong

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=leyfE7sFj4I

[Snowball]

You made a statement that you were not aware of Harte having a reputation of cheating from anyone. An article was found showing that in fact there is at least one out there.

That is not REMOTELY "evidence". You're so blinded by red mist that you can't see it was no more than a peeved Fergusson. Watch the You Tube video.

But it is a fact that Harte approached the referee in one of our games and waved an imaginary card at him, essentially demanding he send the opposition player off. That certainly is poor sportsmanship and something that shouldn't happen. Does it mean he dived and feigned injury? No. But it isn't exactly a ringing endorsement of his character.

That is not "a fact". That is you saying it happened. You are (to my knowledge) the only person to suggest that's what happened.

What game?

perhaps you should consider actually engaging in an adult discussion once in a while.

Well, off you go to bed, then and we'll see who's left.

[Snowball]

Here is the penalty save by Barthez from Harte. Soft shot. Really.

That was Harte doing the Corinthian right thing

[Snowball]

Here is the foul by Barthez on Harte. A dive? Really?

Happy to hear people say they got that one wrong

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=leyfE7sFj4I

What do you think Hoop?

You think that's a definite (nasty and deliberate kick) or a dive?


1. Kick

2. Dive

[Snowball]

I'm confused. When we could defend, but not score goals having a solid defence was the way to do well in this division. Now it's clear Harte is better attacking yet more suspect defensively, he shouldn't be taken out of the team because of what he offers going forwards.

Surely this is contradictory?

Please can you answer my question? I am at a loss.

Royal X, I understand from your PM that you were addressing me, here. I was answering Terminal Boredom.

It's MY belief (in terms of getting results) that clean sheets are the way forward. I was brought up on a diet of 0-0 away and 1-0 or 2-0 at home (when a draw was 1 point and a win 2) and back in the days (I was a long-time Leeds fan in the Revie era as I lived near, and a long time Carlisle fan (Ashman/Stokoe) because my wife was from there) and I would be THRILLED by a dogged rearguard, tough-tackling 0-0 away when we were hammered. It didn't matter, the point was everything.

I believe (again, just MY beliefs) that the way to success is building a VERY tight defence so you have 0-0 and then your midfield/attack only need to get one goal. It's not the prettiest football, but if we won the championship drawing all our away games 0-0 and winning all our home games 1-0, I'd learn to love it.

We were quite clearly (at least according to results) getting the defence right. We had a string of excellent defensive results with just that one anomalous 3-1 at Boro. I WASN'T worried about the lack of goals BECAUSE WE WERE SCORING ENOUGH. We were creeping up the table and growing our GD.

However, against that was the fact/idea that defensively we had been a bit lucky (Leicester/Millwall/Forest) and we WEREN'T that solid. I posted on that and got shot to pieces. The "answer" was therefore, "start scoring goals so we can afford to let in some..."

I THINK, but don't KNOW that McDermott has changed tactics a little bit, freeing the lads to attack but leaving more gaps.

Suddenly we are getting end to end games. Even the 4-0 win at Burnley was 50-50 in possession and Burnley had plenty of chances.

The other confusing element is that recently we have played a string of much better sides, Top, second, third, sixth, seventh, eight (today) and thus it's hard to know exactly what is happening. We'll need another ten games to really know as the next few aren't exactly easy, either. We have fourth and fifth, the erratic but high-scoring Watford, a tricky game at Sheffield.

Until Kebe comes back I would lock down the left hand side (unless we take a punt on Antonio)

When Kebe comes back, his threat may be all we need to make opposition FBs less likely to attack.


Quite simply, the jury is out (IMO)

[Wycombe Royal]

But you KNOW nothing.

Neither do you but that doesn't stop you spouting your crap all day everyday claiming it all to be facts and statistically proven.

I don't understand why you believe yourself to be superior to everyone else when you have been shown up, had stats torn apart and challenges met time and time again.......

I admire your willingness to never accept defeat and it is a good characteristic to have if you are a professional sportsperson but on a forum it make you look very stupid.

Dear Whicker

When I don't KNOW something, I try very hard not to just guess, or make an assertion without foundation
and then act as if it is fact. For all you may decry my ise of statistics, at least I TRY to gather evidence.

Whether I have it right or wrong is not really the point. The point is I do NOT just spout.
I try to back my beliefs (I often FORM my beliefs) based on real evidence.


I know it's very, VERY hard for you to take, but just saying something doesn't make it true.

And if a million people say something, it's still no truer.

Once 99.999999% of people thought the earth was flat. You probably still do.

Insulting people is not the way to go about getting people to listen to your point of view. Someone of your age should now better and you are an embarrassment to people of your generation.

[RobRoyal]

Once 99.999999% of people thought the earth was flat. You probably still do.

More made up statistics.

This is a myth, Snowball. Many peoples knew the world was round long before Columbus.

[Hoop Blah]

Here is the foul by Barthez on Harte. A dive? Really?

Happy to hear people say they got that one wrong

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=leyfE7sFj4I

What do you think Hoop?

You think that's a definite (nasty and deliberate kick) or a dive?


1. Kick

2. Dive

It doesn't matter what I think (I can't watch youtube on this laptop). You said he'd never had his integrity questioned. I showed you otherwise.

I think that more than anything Snowball is actually managing to drum up a lot of animosity towards Harte, just by being such a total a-hole WUM.

Only on here, and to be honest I think the animosity is only really against snowballs line of argument not the player himself. There have been the same concerns and discussions about his ability long before snowball pipped up, and not only at Reading either.

The same thing has happened with Long. I wouldn't give snowball any 'credit' in creating any anti-player feeling, but he's certainly raising the level of awareness on these guys weaknesses by trying to argue they don't exist.

[Hoop Blah]

It's not "the Reading Way", is it? Dear Steve Coppell would be turning in his grave (if he was dead).

Shall we also adopt the Corinthian ideal of not taking any penalties we're awarded? (I know what Shane Long's answer to that would be)

Not so sure about that. In the modern game pretty much all players will seek to gain an advantage with a little bit of gamesmanship here and there.

Doyle and Lita certainly weren't shy to go down under a challenge if it would lead to us getting something, and Long learnt his football under Coppell and certainly isn't the most stable on his feet in the box.

Feigning injury, or making the most of it probably isn't something we used to see too much of, but to think it didn't happen would be a little naive. Players need a rest sometimes, or need to slow the game down (wasn't it Curle who always seem to suffer an injury after we scored a goal?) and getting treatment is a good way to do it.