Ins and Outs – 2017/18

[LC311]

Well done OP brilliant post.

[CountryRoyal]

Well done OP brilliant post.

Almost 2 years to make a first post. Strong lurking.

[muirinho]

It's why he's not a winner. Look at his track record.
Cardiff 06/07 - mid-table
Cardiff 07/08 - mid-table
Forest - 08/09 - bottom half
Forest - 09/10 - bottled promotion and play offs
Forest - 10/11 - bottled play offs
Forest - 11/12 - bottom half
Reading - 12/13 - relegated from the PL
Reading - 13/14 - failed to make the play offs on the last day
Reading - 14/15 - bottom half
Reading - 15/16 - bottom half
Reading - 16/17 - bottled the play offs

He's an incredibly athletic player, with talent, who simply lacks the killer winning instinct. .....But not a winner who will take us forward.

You've used this argument before. Garath McCleary's record must be virtually identical, but you've never made the same case about him. I wonder why!

A lovely guy.

And you say this so often, while blaming him for anything and everything (you haven't even seen him for most of this season), it's beginning to smack of "Some of my best friends are" territory

Unless he wants to leave, he'll be in Stam's plans. As he was for all of our previous managers, apart from some doubts from BMcD in his first season (and as both of his replacements were worse, he should have stuck with him!), and as he has been for a very successful Welsh team.

So since you've decided to grace us with your presence next season, you'll get to see him every second week. Enjoy!

[urz13]

I think, if we are going to carry on with the 5-3-2/3-4-1-2 system we've been playing recently, there's a couple of positions where we should look to sign someone of real first team quality.

Firstly, as good as he has been, perhaps the time has come to replace Gunter - not because I don't rate him, but purely because I don't think his strengths lie in the attacking side of his game. With the system we've been playing the wingbacks have to push very far forward to give us width. Whilst Obita was made for the role I don't think Gunter looks dangerous (or even comfortable) going forward - so signing a specialist, skilful RWB could be a good idea.

Secondly I'd be tempted to bring in another CB - I'm warming to Blackett with each passing game but again I'm not sure if he quite has the quality to nail a starting berth. Another experienced head could be just what we need as only McShane is particularly experienced from our CB's and he's struggled with injuries a little. A theme for most good Championship sides is an experienced defence, so without going overboard another solid CB might be a good idea.

On the wings, I hope Hurtado and Meite can stake a claim. I think we're fine here as McCleary is obviously class and Beerens is a good standard too. We've got Popa and Meite who could break through next season as well as academy products so we should be fine. If a couple leave, then we should use it as an excuse to upgrade and sign someone of top quality if possible.

Midfield wise the most important signing is Danny Williams on a new deal. Swift can only get better, Kelly and Evans have huge potential and would already walk into most sides and VDB is a solid defensive option. If the option was there to bring Tshibola back I'd take it, but other than that I think we're ok. If Williams does leave, we'll need to spend on a new box-to-box CM, preferably one who is creative and will add a few goals.

Finally up front it's clear we'll have to sign someone quality as we can't just rely on Yann all season. I can't see any of the academy players or Mendes really stepping up - Meite could play a bit part role as a ST but we really do need a new one. I don't want Grabban as he takes about half an hour to decide what to do whenever he's got the ball, so Brian will have to get his scouting cap on and try and get someone who fits the system and will score 15+.

Essentially I'd be looking for an experienced CB, a dedicated, attacking RWB, a top-quality striker and potentially a winger or CM. A lot will depend on outgoings - I expect several to move on but overall this should be a good window if we can improve, rather than rebuild the squad.

[bobby1413]

We still have Hurtado?

Bloody hell, there's a few players mentioned here that I completely forgot we had or even existed

[Norfolk Royal]

Why do people keep saying Hurtado is a valid option? He may have had a half decent season wherever he is now but we've had a good look at him already.

[tidus_mi2]

Why do people keep saying Hurtado is a valid option? He may have had a half decent season wherever he is now but we've had a good look at him already.

Hurtado has been on loan since before Stam joined, he hasn't been able to recall him so who knows? Maybe Stam does see him as a viable option but hasn't been able to use him.

[WP Uni]

The Gunter/McCleary partnership can do wonders. The 5-3-2 system doesn't really work with Gunter but then again I don't think that system has really worked. Much prefer the 4-3-3.

[muirinho]

I think, if we are going to carry on with the 5-3-2/3-4-1-2 system we've been playing recently, there's a couple of positions where we should look to sign someone of real first team quality.

Firstly, as good as he has been, perhaps the time has come to replace Gunter - not because I don't rate him, but purely because I don't think his strengths lie in the attacking side of his game. With the system we've been playing the wingbacks have to push very far forward to give us width. Whilst Obita was made for the role I don't think Gunter looks dangerous (or even comfortable) going forward - so signing a specialist, skilful RWB could be a good idea.

Obita and Gunter are different kind of wingers. Obita takes on his man. Gunter passes inside and runs for the overlap. He had some lovely interplay with Danny Williams, Swift and McCleary during the season, particularly when the pass back is timed so he can run onto it and cross first time. But if the midfielders aren't looking for that option, then he's standing in space admiring the scenery. I think people think he plays better for Wales because he tries harder or something - it's not, it's because he has better midfielders to interact with.

so - if we replace Danny with somebody equally good, and boost creativity in our midfield, then he's fine. Especially as he's versatile, making it easier to change formations depending on the opposition. If we are relying on a winger to create his own opportunities and do a lot of running with the ball, then he should be replaced with somebody who takes on his man. It's a question of styles.

Don't particularly rate Ryan Fredericks as an option though. 5 assists all season in the "free-scoring football-playing" Fulham side. Gunts got a goal and 3 assists, Obita got 3 goals and 4. IMO Ryan Fredericks is not better than what we have.

[The Informant]

In an ideal world this is how I see our team if we are going for auto promotion next season.

Obviously I think we'll do well with the squad as it is but I think we'll be a top side with some additions.


451

.......................................Al Habsi............................................

New Player..............Moore........Illori....................New Player


..................................Kelly........Evans........................................

.....................................New Player.............................................

McCleary.................................................................New Player

.......................................New Player..........................................


5 3 2

.......................................Al Habsi...................................................

...........................New Player...Moore....Illori.......................................
New Player.................................................................New Player.......

.................................Kelly.............Evans..............................................

......................................New Player....................................................

...........................Kermorgant........New Player..................................

[windermereROYAL]

Get Tammy Abrahams in. would love him here, pacy and strong

[NewCorkSeth]

In an ideal world this is how I see our team if we are going for auto promotion next season.

Obviously I think we'll do well with the squad as it is but I think we'll be a top side with some additions.


451

.......................................Al Habsi............................................

New Player..............Moore........Illori....................New Player


..................................Kelly........Evans........................................

.....................................New Player.............................................

McCleary.................................................................New Player

.......................................New Player..........................................


5 3 2

.......................................Al Habsi...................................................

...........................New Player...Moore....Illori.......................................
New Player.................................................................New Player.......

.................................Kelly.............Evans..............................................

......................................New Player....................................................

...........................Kermorgant........New Player..................................

You think we need 5 first team players? That looks to be our most expensive transfer window ever.

To buy a better than we have RB, LB, AMC, LW and Striker is at a minimum 15 million surely. Finding loans might dent that figure but I doubt it'll be easy to find a player better than Swift who is a) willing to join or b) in our price range.

[RoyalJones]

I think, if we are going to carry on with the 5-3-2/3-4-1-2 system we've been playing recently, there's a couple of positions where we should look to sign someone of real first team quality.

Firstly, as good as he has been, perhaps the time has come to replace Gunter - not because I don't rate him, but purely because I don't think his strengths lie in the attacking side of his game. With the system we've been playing the wingbacks have to push very far forward to give us width. Whilst Obita was made for the role I don't think Gunter looks dangerous (or even comfortable) going forward - so signing a specialist, skilful RWB could be a good idea.

Secondly I'd be tempted to bring in another CB - I'm warming to Blackett with each passing game but again I'm not sure if he quite has the quality to nail a starting berth. Another experienced head could be just what we need as only McShane is particularly experienced from our CB's and he's struggled with injuries a little. A theme for most good Championship sides is an experienced defence, so without going overboard another solid CB might be a good idea.

On the wings, I hope Hurtado and Meite can stake a claim. I think we're fine here as McCleary is obviously class and Beerens is a good standard too. We've got Popa and Meite who could break through next season as well as academy products so we should be fine. If a couple leave, then we should use it as an excuse to upgrade and sign someone of top quality if possible.

Midfield wise the most important signing is Danny Williams on a new deal. Swift can only get better, Kelly and Evans have huge potential and would already walk into most sides and VDB is a solid defensive option. If the option was there to bring Tshibola back I'd take it, but other than that I think we're ok. If Williams does leave, we'll need to spend on a new box-to-box CM, preferably one who is creative and will add a few goals.

Finally up front it's clear we'll have to sign someone quality as we can't just rely on Yann all season. I can't see any of the academy players or Mendes really stepping up - Meite could play a bit part role as a ST but we really do need a new one. I don't want Grabban as he takes about half an hour to decide what to do whenever he's got the ball, so Brian will have to get his scouting cap on and try and get someone who fits the system and will score 15+.

Essentially I'd be looking for an experienced CB, a dedicated, attacking RWB, a top-quality striker and potentially a winger or CM. A lot will depend on outgoings - I expect several to move on but overall this should be a good window if we can improve, rather than rebuild the squad.

I know that the SPL is basically a pub league compared to the Premier League and Championship but I do remember someone on twitter saying he put a sterling performance in for Partick Thistle against Celtic at Celtic Park. Does anyone else think he deserves a chance? I think Cooper will be on his way, Andresson and Dickie may not be ready yet, so you may be right in thinking we need another centre back, but i'm not overly sure.

Firmly agree on the view that we need to get Williams tied down to a new deal. I also think we may need to buy more than one creative midfielder, to sort out how static we actually are a lot of the time.

We do have Fosu, Beerens and Harriott, but do you think we will need to invest in a better quality left midfielder? I'm not convinced any of those three at top end Championship players although Beerens has scored important goals for us.

In terms of strikers, we will need more than one to really ensure that we are just as competitive as we were in the season just gone.

[RoyalJones]

Why do people keep saying Hurtado is a valid option? He may have had a half decent season wherever he is now but we've had a good look at him already.

Hurtado has been on loan since before Stam joined, he hasn't been able to recall him so who knows? Maybe Stam does see him as a viable option but hasn't been able to use him.

Personally I think he'll be a good asset to have

[RoyalJones]

Get Tammy Abrahams in. would love him here, pacy and strong

Think he might be in the Premier League at a side like Huddersfield in my opinion. Scoring that many goals in a poor Bristol City side was impressive.

[RoyalJones]

In an ideal world this is how I see our team if we are going for auto promotion next season.

Obviously I think we'll do well with the squad as it is but I think we'll be a top side with some additions.


451

.......................................Al Habsi............................................

New Player..............Moore........Illori....................New Player


..................................Kelly........Evans........................................

.....................................New Player.............................................

McCleary.................................................................New Player

.......................................New Player..........................................


5 3 2

.......................................Al Habsi...................................................

...........................New Player...Moore....Illori.......................................
New Player.................................................................New Player.......

.................................Kelly.............Evans..............................................

......................................New Player....................................................

...........................Kermorgant........New Player..................................

I would personally put McShane in that team with 5 at the back but I agree that he shouldn't get in the team over Moore and Ilori, even if he is the captain. I would also be tempted to put Swift in those two teams as well as Obita at left back. Any other observations?

[muirinho]

Stick to hurling.

Who is that aimed at?

Your "new players required" little diagram might be appropriate if we had been promoted. But unless we totally smash FFP regulations, spreading the investment across that many players in the Championship is just going to result in players no better that what we already have. If even that.

I reckon two first-name-on-the-teamsheet players at most - so long as they are serious quality. For me, most important positions are a creative midfielder, and a striker. Everything else, we should be able to manage with what we've got, and what we've got coming through

[NewCorkSeth]

In an ideal world this is how I see our team if we are going for auto promotion next season.

Obviously I think we'll do well with the squad as it is but I think we'll be a top side with some additions.


451

.......................................Al Habsi............................................

New Player..............Moore........Illori....................New Player


..................................Kelly........Evans........................................

.....................................New Player.............................................

McCleary.................................................................New Player

.......................................New Player..........................................


5 3 2

.......................................Al Habsi...................................................

...........................New Player...Moore....Illori.......................................
New Player.................................................................New Player.......

.................................Kelly.............Evans..............................................

......................................New Player....................................................

...........................Kermorgant........New Player..................................

You think we need 5 first team players? That looks to be our most expensive transfer window ever.

To buy a better than we have RB, LB, AMC, LW and Striker is at a minimum 15 million surely. Finding loans might dent that figure but I doubt it'll be easy to find a player better than Swift who is a) willing to join or b) in our price range.

I think you know nothing

We got some great players last summer for next to nothing and we have fresh investment now.

Very probably which is why I didn't make any statements of fact and merely responded with my opinion, which I'm glad to see was met with a mature and thoughtful response.

1) We may have fresh investment but we don't know how much the new owners are willing to spend and as Villa proved spending doesn't equal success. They spent around £30 million on 3 strikers this season so I would presume any rates for proven strikers who would either replace Kermorgant or play along side him as your formations above suggest could cost around the £10 million mark. Of course it is possible we could sign a little known striker for a low fee who could go on to be fantastic but i hasten to add we bought 2 low fee forwards last summer (Meite and Mendes) as well as Rakels the season before. It is rare that strikers have an immediate impact in their first season in the Championship.

2) I struggle to imagine where we can pick up a RB and a LB on the cheap who are guaranteed to come in and replace our current first choices. The same goes for LW. It seems odd to defend your opinion that we need to replace 5 positions in the team with better quality by pointing to our last 2 windows and saying that we bought in quality players then. If we had such a successful window why are 5 positions (2 taken by last season transfer, Swift and Beerens) considered too weak?

3) We signed 12 players over the last 2 windows (not including loans) - Mendes, Meite, Jaakola, Harriott, Weiser, Van Den Berg, Swift, Gravenberch, Popa, Beerens, Moore and Ilori.

The players with the most minutes out of those signings are Moore (3845) Blackett (3169) Beerens (3128) Swift (2855) and Van Den Berg (2262). Only one of those players have you deemed good enough to stay in the starting line-up...
The rest of our permanent signings have less than 500 minutes of action. So I don't think I'm far off in saying if we were to sign 5 new immediate starters it would be more expensive than any of our previous windows considering 4 of our most important transfers in last season are not good enough according to you.

[RoyalJones]

As shown in those teams, I do think we have a good spine to build our squad around, something we didn't really have last season. Clear progress has been made but we may need to spend quite a bit of money to top quality first team additions that we desire. All depends really on the retained and released lists of different clubs.

Some of the players released:
Alex Bruce - however looking at twitter he may not be the right character to bring to the club.
Marvin Emnes - may not be spectacular but did look good for Blackburn against Reading when we were at home to them, scoring record isn't the best either so that is probably a non starter.
Marley Watkins - again not overly spectacular.
Charlie Taylor - probably unrealistic seeing as he has attracted interest from the Premier League.
There's quite a few players at Norwich and Sheffield Wednesday but none of them that are released are better than what we already have.

This just shows how we probably need to spend quite a bit of money to get the players that we do want.

[muirinho]

With our far reaching scouting network these days, and the extra cash, I think we will get 4-5 players of quality

Like we did last season, that you are now rejecting??

FFP doesn't really exist anymore.

At the sort of amounts needed for your wholesale purchases, yes it does. We'd blow the three years losses allowed!

And the hurling comment was aimed at the mick.

which one? Still not narrowing it down (actually I'm assuming NewCorkSeth - he having pointed out some of the flaws in your reasoning so far)