England - the future....

[bcubed]

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[WestYorksRoyal]

It seems pretty obvious to me. You can tinker with inverted full backs like TAA and Lewis and small things, but fundamentally a functional team at the top level needs:

- The ability to control possession and beat the press. That means a player like Gomes or Wharton alongside Rice, who can do more of his box to box Arsenal role.

- Options to stretch the game by running in behind and offering width. This probably means Saka and Gordon/Watkins.

- This only leaves room for 1, or possibly 2 of Foden, Grealish, Palmer or Bellingham. If Kane is fit, you can definitely only play 1 of them as he likes to drop deep too. If you play Watkins and a natural LB who can provide width, perhaps you can pick 2, but that doesn't work with Lewis who likes to come into the middle too.

I know us armchair fans don't have the credentials of Carsley and Southgate, but sometimes obvious solutions are the right ones. Use your coaching badges to get extra wins, like how to maximise TAA's ability on the ball.

[Royal Rother]

Terrible performance.

I assumed Gomes was injured.

Greece could have scored 4 or 5.

The Man City and Arsenal players were particularly crap.

[Sanguine]

Carsley's not the answer is he.

He might be.

I noted this a lot during Southgate's time. He had particular limitations. But what we didn't generally do (supported by Southgate having one of the highest win rates in history for the national side) is lose competitive matches that we 'shouldn't'. We beat the teams that we should beat. I did say more than once in the last couple of years that the price we might pay for a more expansive game and a different strategy, is that we lose games against smaller teams.

There isn't some magic bullet when it comes to success at international level. Teams are too good these days. Our poor performance aside, Greece were excellent - and they are barely in the top 50 in the FIFA rankings.

You can play it tight, like Southgate did, and maybe your problem is unlocking the best sides in the most important games.
Or you can play more expansive football and you might get those stunning results, or you also might lose in a pretty embarassing manner.

There isn't some magic way to just do something in between.

[Sanguine]

- The ability to control possession and beat the press. That means a player like Gomes or Wharton alongside Rice, who can do more of his box to box Arsenal role.

- Options to stretch the game by running in behind and offering width. This probably means Saka and Gordon/Watkins.

Not being funny but, Southgate knew this, didn't he? He played a defensive midfielder (for a long time Henderson), and he played Saka and Foden wider.

I mean, much of the criticism of Southgate was that he couldn't/wouldn't fit all these names into the team.

[WestYorksRoyal]

- The ability to control possession and beat the press. That means a player like Gomes or Wharton alongside Rice, who can do more of his box to box Arsenal role.

- Options to stretch the game by running in behind and offering width. This probably means Saka and Gordon/Watkins.

Not being funny but, Southgate knew this, didn't he? He played a defensive midfielder (for a long time Henderson), and he played Saka and Foden wider.

I mean, much of the criticism of Southgate was that he couldn't/wouldn't fit all these names into the team.

He didn't get everything right. Henderson added defensive cover, but neither he not give the control in possession that a player like Jorginho does. The closest we came was when Phillips was in form. I like to think he'd he giving Wharton and Gomes a real chance ahead of 2026 to fix this.

But he got his selection at the Euros blatant wrong. Foden, Bellingham and Kane got into each other's way, especially without Shaw fit. He was also too scared to put a big name on the bench.

[Sanguine]

I know he didn't get everything right, I just thought it somewhat ironic that after one defeat since Southgate left, I read a post that correctly in my view describes what the team needed last night, and that that was exactly what Southgate tried to do.

[Sutekh]

Some pundits saying Carsley's plan was evidently failing after 20 minutes but yet he let it carry on

At least it was the cr@p competition at not something that mattered. Another failure in this competition will be definitely see the end of him as manager and meanwhile the media will probably drive this narrative to its conclusion.

Howe please.

[South Coast Royal]

I turned over after watching darts and saw no build-up to the game.
Looking at the side, I knew Kane was an injury doubt but with that line-up were Watkins and Solanke injured as well?-it turned out not to be the case.

This was not a micky mouse competition nor a friendly so why not have an orthodox striker as we always do regardless of the manager?
Memories of the management trying to fit Gerrard, Lampard and Scholes into the same side came back and it just looked disjointed

Presumably Carsley was trying to make an impression as coach but when he said afterwards that they had only spent 25 minutes of training with this set-up I was as gobsmacked as every other viewer.
WTF had the players been doing since Sunday?

I never understand the need for so many days of players being together-apart from one or two new ones they had been together for a month or so at the Euros and only a month ago had a further 10 days in camp.

Last night Carsley wrote his own dismissal letter especially as he said that he expected to be back with the U21s after his 6 game run.

Never mind Potter or Howe isn't it time , with 2 years to go till the World Cup, for an experienced international manager to be appointed or at least somebody that has been successful in top European football?
Just because Capello wasn't successful surely doesn't mean that the next manager has to be English or British or Irish?

Did the FA miss a trick in not sounding out Klopp?
Tuchel knows English and top European football.
Ancelotti might be ready for a new challenge.

Rice, Foden and Palmer were wandering all over the place , sometimes getting in each other's way and Colwill just doesn't look decisive enough to me in his defending.
Pickford pissing about earlier was not a good sign.
Why on earth didn't Watkins start when he has been the natural back-up to Kane?
Why didn't Carsley change it at half-time when the plan was clearly not working?

So , yet another international break before the end of the year-what will Carsley come up with next time?
Managing U21s is far removed from managing established star players and although Southgate did well to step up having also had some experience of managing at club level and the same happened with the Spanish guy at the Euros it is clearly not a blueprint for automatic success.

The FA should make the change now but the old stuffed shirts probably won't want to admit to making a mistake so soon.

[Sutekh]

I turned over after watching darts and saw no build-up to the game.
Looking at the side, I knew Kane was an injury doubt but with that line-up were Watkins and Solanke injured as well?-it turned out not to be the case.

This was not a micky mouse competition nor a friendly so why not have an orthodox striker as we always do regardless of the manager?
Memories of the management trying to fit Gerrard, Lampard and Scholes into the same side came back and it just looked disjointed

Presumably Carsley was trying to make an impression as coach but when he said afterwards that they had only spent 25 minutes of training with this set-up I was as gobsmacked as every other viewer.
WTF had the players been doing since Sunday?

I never understand the need for so many days of players being together-apart from one or two new ones they had been together for a month or so at the Euros and only a month ago had a further 10 days in camp.

Last night Carsley wrote his own dismissal letter especially as he said that he expected to be back with the U21s after his 6 game run.

Never mind Potter or Howe isn't it time , with 2 years to go till the World Cup, for an experienced international manager to be appointed or at least somebody that has been successful in top European football?
Just because Capello wasn't successful surely doesn't mean that the next manager has to be English or British or Irish?

Did the FA miss a trick in not sounding out Klopp?
Tuchel knows English and top European football.
Ancelotti might be ready for a new challenge.

Rice, Foden and Palmer were wandering all over the place , sometimes getting in each other's way and Colwill just doesn't look decisive enough to me in his defending.
Pickford pissing about earlier was not a good sign.
Why on earth didn't Watkins start when he has been the natural back-up to Kane?
Why didn't Carsley change it at half-time when the plan was clearly not working?

So , yet another international break before the end of the year-what will Carsley come up with next time?
Managing U21s is far removed from managing established star players and although Southgate did well to step up having also had some experience of managing at club level and the same happened with the Spanish guy at the Euros it is clearly not a blueprint for automatic success.

The FA should make the change now but the old stuffed shirts probably won't want to admit to making a mistake so soon.

The FA will do what they always do and go for a nice easy going gentleman who won't rock their quiet little gravy boat.

[Brogue]

Tuchel will be the next manager

[SouthDownsRoyal]

Lee Carsley admits he hopes to go back to the England U21s but refuses to rule himself out as Gareth Southgate's permanent successor.

Which do you want then, Lee?

[Sutekh]

13 Henderson
12 Walker
6 Guéhi
5 Stones
2 Alexander-Arnold
19 Gomes
4 Rice
20 Palmer
8 Bellingham
17 Grealish
9 Kane

[Sutekh]

God this is a turgid performance, wonder how good England would be if they had a world class defender or two.

[LUX]

Blimey, Finland should at least be level. England’s stars look no better than the Finns.

Tbh I get the impression England are not taking this tournament seriously. Fair enough, but why not just play fringe players?

[WestYorksRoyal]

Great free kick by TAA, but only possible because we had Watkins running in behind and get us to the edge of their box. Why do we wait for 65 minutes before we stretch the game? Team so much more balanced without 4 no. 10s.

[Royal Rother]

We are still such a boring / frustratingly unambitious / predictable team to watch.

I though the clip they showed at HT when Kane came deep and there was a perfect opportunity for Bellingham to shoot into space behind, completely unseen by him and everyone else, was very revealing.

[WestYorksRoyal]

Carsley looks a bit out of his depth. It's not just a reaction to Greece, it's his comments in interviews that betray a "what am I doing here?" Imposter syndrome vibe. I'm not sure he backs himself, so how can the rest of us back him?

It's perhaps unrealistic to expect a good coach to adapt to the scrutiny and media circus of the job. Southgate was very adept at it, and you expect the likes of Tuchel and Howe would manage it better too.

[bcubed]

Carsley looks a bit out of his depth. It's not just a reaction to Greece, it's his comments in interviews that betray a "what am I doing here?" Imposter syndrome vibe. I'm not sure he backs himself, so how can the rest of us back him?

It's perhaps unrealistic to expect a good coach to adapt to the scrutiny and media circus of the job. Southgate was very adept at it, and you expect the likes of Tuchel and Howe would manage it better too.

Definitely got a bit of the caught in the headlights look about hin

[Sanguine]

Sky Sports say that the FA are in talks with Thomas Tuchel over the England job. This is excellent.