MATCHWATCH : Rotherham United (h)

[Nameless]

Once this season is out the way are all our FFP restrictions etc out the way?

No one knows Until we know our financial position.
We still have a 6 point deduction hanging over us.

[Zip]

Once this season is out the way are all our FFP restrictions etc out the way?

Still not known but I would certainly hope so. We must be complying with the EFL as all signings have required their approval. Our gates have been similar to recent signings and we have been on SKY plenty of times so all in all I would hope we will be free of the embargo in the summer.

[Royal Rother]

I still don't buy it. It would be a very poor contract to sign for a mediocre player in a position we had options already.

We had NGW, who had never played at this level and had started poorly, Hoilett, who was also first choice right wing back, and McIntyre, who was starting at centre back and had never played wing back before (although he's looked very good when filling in there since). Signing the guy who did just fine last season for us made a lot of sense.

You'd think Chelsea might require a similar deal for Casadei... but he's dropped after one game for McIntyre in midfield.

It's likely any deal would be tied to wages - i.e. if Baba plays then Chelsea pay his wages, if he doesn't then we do. I know Chelsea have done similar deals in the past, but can't remember if they were with us (possibly Chalobah, Baker, or Miazga?). It might not be all or nothing, but maybe it's 70% Chelsea if he plays and 30% if he doesn't. Advantage to Chelsea is that if their player plays then theoretically his value should go up - but I don't think that logic holds for a player like Rahman in the final year of his contract.

Rahman is 28, having signed for Chelsea aged 21 after playing 50+ games in the Bundesliga. He's signed at least one new contract since.

Casadei is 20. He's never played professionally before. He's also signed for Chelsea in the post-Abramovic era, when they are cutting wages in favour of big transfer fees.

It seems likely to me that Rahman is on more money than Casadei, and so if we have a choice between paying 10% of Rahman's wage and 80% of Casadei's, or 10% of Casadei's wage and 80% of Rahman's, we're going to choose to pay less of Rahman's.

Obviously lots of hypotheticals and unknowns in there, but that's one way I can see that working out.

NGW started a littly wobbly, but still managed to be one of the real bright sparks. Which is why no one can understand why Rahman is ahead of him.

You've missed several options. There was also John Clarke, and the opportunity to play Yiadom on the left with Abrefa or Hoilett on the right.

Your last point about choosing to pay less of Rahman's as its likely bigger than Casadei directly contradicts your point given that would mean Casadei would have missed out when all the loanees were available, not Rahman as actually happened.

It occurs to me that Ince penalises mistakes made due to a player being young and inexperienced, but is happy to tolerate mistakes due to a seasoned player just, well, being shite.

I don’t like that.

[Hound]

Once this season is out the way are all our FFP restrictions etc out the way?

No one knows Until we know our financial position.
We still have a 6 point deduction hanging over us.

But nothing to suggest we have broken the ‘business plan’ set out by the EFL though is there. Plus the cup game, sky appearances so should be ok I’d presume

[Stranded]

Once this season is out the way are all our FFP restrictions etc out the way?

No one knows Until we know our financial position.
We still have a 6 point deduction hanging over us.

But nothing to suggest we have broken the ‘business plan’ set out by the EFL though is there. Plus the cup game, sky appearances so should be ok I’d presume

The nature of the penalty though is for the 6 points to be deducted we likely need to have breached FFP again this season i.e. lose more than 13m - so in reality, it would more likely be a 15 or 18 point penalty as would also be deducted points for the new breach.

If there were any real danger, I think we would have heard whispers by now.

[YorkshireRoyal99]

No one knows Until we know our financial position.
We still have a 6 point deduction hanging over us.

But nothing to suggest we have broken the ‘business plan’ set out by the EFL though is there. Plus the cup game, sky appearances so should be ok I’d presume

The nature of the penalty though is for the 6 points to be deducted we likely need to have breached FFP again this season i.e. lose more than 13m - so in reality, it would more likely be a 15 or 18 point penalty as would also be deducted points for the new breach.

If there were any real danger, I think we would have heard whispers by now.

I'm sure the club have recently told STAR that the club are on forecast to meet the EFL Business Plan as well so I don't think there is much to be concerned with in that regard at the moment.

[paultheroyal]

But nothing to suggest we have broken the ‘business plan’ set out by the EFL though is there. Plus the cup game, sky appearances so should be ok I’d presume

The nature of the penalty though is for the 6 points to be deducted we likely need to have breached FFP again this season i.e. lose more than 13m - so in reality, it would more likely be a 15 or 18 point penalty as would also be deducted points for the new breach.

If there were any real danger, I think we would have heard whispers by now.

I'm sure the club have recently told STAR that the club are on forecast to meet the EFL Business Plan as well so I don't think there is much to be concerned with in that regard at the moment.

and yet Dellor was banging on about another 6 points deduction hypothesis on Tuesday night because he keeps talking about 50 points (which he thinks is too many) and the need to avoid relegation. He wonders whether we are still close to the wind.

[YorkshireRoyal99]

The nature of the penalty though is for the 6 points to be deducted we likely need to have breached FFP again this season i.e. lose more than 13m - so in reality, it would more likely be a 15 or 18 point penalty as would also be deducted points for the new breach.

If there were any real danger, I think we would have heard whispers by now.

I'm sure the club have recently told STAR that the club are on forecast to meet the EFL Business Plan as well so I don't think there is much to be concerned with in that regard at the moment.

and yet Dellor was banging on about another 6 points deduction hypothesis on Tuesday night because he keeps talking about 50 points (which he thinks is too many) and the need to avoid relegation. He wonders whether we are still close to the wind.

I'm not even sure why it's even in conversation really from fans or pundits. Yeah fair enough it's always looming over us but we haven't really heard anything that would suggest we are near breaking any rules that have been placed against us this season and the club have already confirmed that we are on forecast to comply with FFP regulations at the moment.

At the end of the day, just finish 7 points+ ahead of 22nd by the end of the season to be absolutely sure of survival.

[Hound]

I’m sure we are very close to the limit. We’ve needed to maximise what we can do and squeeze out every last pound that we are allowed to spend

[YorkshireRoyal99]

Yeah there probably isn't loads of wriggle room but I don't think it's worth the conversation starter of potentially breaking any rules that have been set against us, especially when the club have said that we are on forecast at the moment. If we begin to hear any differently then yes fair enough.

[Snowflake Royal]

We had NGW, who had never played at this level and had started poorly, Hoilett, who was also first choice right wing back, and McIntyre, who was starting at centre back and had never played wing back before (although he's looked very good when filling in there since). Signing the guy who did just fine last season for us made a lot of sense.

It's likely any deal would be tied to wages - i.e. if Baba plays then Chelsea pay his wages, if he doesn't then we do. I know Chelsea have done similar deals in the past, but can't remember if they were with us (possibly Chalobah, Baker, or Miazga?). It might not be all or nothing, but maybe it's 70% Chelsea if he plays and 30% if he doesn't. Advantage to Chelsea is that if their player plays then theoretically his value should go up - but I don't think that logic holds for a player like Rahman in the final year of his contract.

Rahman is 28, having signed for Chelsea aged 21 after playing 50+ games in the Bundesliga. He's signed at least one new contract since.

Casadei is 20. He's never played professionally before. He's also signed for Chelsea in the post-Abramovic era, when they are cutting wages in favour of big transfer fees.

It seems likely to me that Rahman is on more money than Casadei, and so if we have a choice between paying 10% of Rahman's wage and 80% of Casadei's, or 10% of Casadei's wage and 80% of Rahman's, we're going to choose to pay less of Rahman's.

Obviously lots of hypotheticals and unknowns in there, but that's one way I can see that working out.

NGW started a littly wobbly, but still managed to be one of the real bright sparks. Which is why no one can understand why Rahman is ahead of him.

You've missed several options. There was also John Clarke, and the opportunity to play Yiadom on the left with Abrefa or Hoilett on the right.

Your last point about choosing to pay less of Rahman's as its likely bigger than Casadei directly contradicts your point given that would mean Casadei would have missed out when all the loanees were available, not Rahman as actually happened.

It occurs to me that Ince penalises mistakes made due to a player being young and inexperienced, but is happy to tolerate mistakes due to a seasoned player just, well, being shite.

I don’t like that.

Hmmm, it's actually a little hard to argue he doesn't fo that.

[Snowflake Royal]

Dellor's not very bright and full of shit at the best of times.

[Nameless]

Dellor's not very bright and full of shit at the best of times.

And his job is to fill air time and generate phone calls. He’s not an investigative journalist.

[Nameless]

Yeah there probably isn't loads of wriggle room but I don't think it's worth the conversation starter of potentially breaking any rules that have been set against us, especially when the club have said that we are on forecast at the moment. If we begin to hear any differently then yes fair enough.

Of course it’s worth remembering we still have a suspended penalty hanging over us !
The question was are we free ofrestrictions come the end of the season and the answer is we have no real idea.
I have always said it would need a deliberate decision to not hit the business plan and for the EFL to be complicit in that and I think we will be ok.
However we may find that we remain under some kind of monitoring,and depending how close we are to FFP limits we may find we still have some limits on transfers (I could see us needing to get clearance for spending any transfer fee, but not having specific limits)

[YorkshireRoyal99]

Yeah there probably isn't loads of wriggle room but I don't think it's worth the conversation starter of potentially breaking any rules that have been set against us, especially when the club have said that we are on forecast at the moment. If we begin to hear any differently then yes fair enough.

Of course it’s worth remembering we still have a suspended penalty hanging over us !
The question was are we free ofrestrictions come the end of the season and the answer is we have no real idea.
I have always said it would need a deliberate decision to not hit the business plan and for the EFL to be complicit in that and I think we will be ok.
However we may find that we remain under some kind of monitoring,and depending how close we are to FFP limits we may find we still have some limits on transfers (I could see us needing to get clearance for spending any transfer fee, but not having specific limits)

I never said it wasn't worth remembering, I said it wasn't worth the conversation when there is no evidence to suggest we are close to/going to break any rules, quite the contrary actually. What I was answering to was Dellor talking about the potential for a points deduction.

[Stranded]

Yeah there probably isn't loads of wriggle room but I don't think it's worth the conversation starter of potentially breaking any rules that have been set against us, especially when the club have said that we are on forecast at the moment. If we begin to hear any differently then yes fair enough.

Of course it’s worth remembering we still have a suspended penalty hanging over us !
The question was are we free ofrestrictions come the end of the season and the answer is we have no real idea.
I have always said it would need a deliberate decision to not hit the business plan and for the EFL to be complicit in that and I think we will be ok.
However we may find that we remain under some kind of monitoring,and depending how close we are to FFP limits we may find we still have some limits on transfers (I could see us needing to get clearance for spending any transfer fee, but not having specific limits)

We may have limits as you say but that would probably be unprecedented in that we agreed a penalty and seem to be abiding by it - so once out we should be able to trade under the same terms as other clubs i.e. minimise loses to the 39m over 3 years but knowing full well that if we so much as go a pound over we will get the full 12pts thrown at us.

[bcubed]

We had NGW, who had never played at this level and had started poorly, Hoilett, who was also first choice right wing back, and McIntyre, who was starting at centre back and had never played wing back before (although he's looked very good when filling in there since). Signing the guy who did just fine last season for us made a lot of sense.

It's likely any deal would be tied to wages - i.e. if Baba plays then Chelsea pay his wages, if he doesn't then we do. I know Chelsea have done similar deals in the past, but can't remember if they were with us (possibly Chalobah, Baker, or Miazga?). It might not be all or nothing, but maybe it's 70% Chelsea if he plays and 30% if he doesn't. Advantage to Chelsea is that if their player plays then theoretically his value should go up - but I don't think that logic holds for a player like Rahman in the final year of his contract.

Rahman is 28, having signed for Chelsea aged 21 after playing 50+ games in the Bundesliga. He's signed at least one new contract since.

Casadei is 20. He's never played professionally before. He's also signed for Chelsea in the post-Abramovic era, when they are cutting wages in favour of big transfer fees.

It seems likely to me that Rahman is on more money than Casadei, and so if we have a choice between paying 10% of Rahman's wage and 80% of Casadei's, or 10% of Casadei's wage and 80% of Rahman's, we're going to choose to pay less of Rahman's.

Obviously lots of hypotheticals and unknowns in there, but that's one way I can see that working out.

NGW started a littly wobbly, but still managed to be one of the real bright sparks. Which is why no one can understand why Rahman is ahead of him.

You've missed several options. There was also John Clarke, and the opportunity to play Yiadom on the left with Abrefa or Hoilett on the right.

Your last point about choosing to pay less of Rahman's as its likely bigger than Casadei directly contradicts your point given that would mean Casadei would have missed out when all the loanees were available, not Rahman as actually happened.

It occurs to me that Ince penalises mistakes made due to a player being young and inexperienced, but is happy to tolerate mistakes due to a seasoned player just, well, being shite.

I don’t like that.

I have the same nagging doubts
I don't like it either

[Brogue]

If it was that close to us getting another breach I doubt we would have brought in Casadei…

[Nameless]

If it was that close to us getting another breach I doubt we would have brought in Casadei…

Depends on the terms. We sent several of our youngsters out on loan remember.
I don’t think there are any signs we’ll be in trouble but assuming we’ll be free to go crazy in the summer is probably wrong …

[Brogue]

If it was that close to us getting another breach I doubt we would have brought in Casadei…

Depends on the terms. We sent several of our youngsters out on loan remember.
I don’t think there are any signs we’ll be in trouble but assuming we’ll be free to go crazy in the summer is probably wrong …

who is assuming we will go crazy in the summer?